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Garden Gate:  Square Foot Gardening  |
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Idahospud
True Blue Farmgirl
67 Posts
Nikki
Emmett
Idaho
USA
67 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 17 2005 : 10:33:16 PM
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Howdy gals; sorry I haven't been around much. Homeschooling and having a newborn make my computer time scarce!
Anyway . . . I need to be thinking and planning my vegetable garden. We've been in our new house for three years now, and I haven't put a veg garden in yet (working on flower beds and berry patches). I want to try out the Square Foot method (I have the Bartholomew book) and thought I'd start a thread about that here.
Have any of you used this method before? What do you like/dislike about it? What did you use to build your (raised) beds out of? What were/are your favorite sized beds? Did you have any surprises (good or bad) using this method?
I'm looking forward to discussing this! |
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Aunt Jenny
True Blue Farmgirl
11381 Posts
Jenny
middle of
Utah
USA
11381 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2005 : 07:03:50 AM
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I loved it the times I have done it. I have so much more space now that i havn't been doing it, but I probably should. It is a great method! Hmmmmm...maybe I will get that book out! I mostly always did 4X8 ft. beds and was surprized at how much I could grow in 4 of them!! I had them laidout in a nice design. Wish I had a way to draw it...in my backyard. I did it at two dfferent homes and different type soils. The only think I had a problem with was that where I lived then we had terrible bermuda grass and I had trouble keeping it out of the boxes by the second year..here by problem would no doubt be wild morning glory that I fight here. but all in all it is really a good way to go..
Jenny in Utah
Bloom where you are planted! |
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Eileen
True Blue Farmgirl
1199 Posts
Eileen
USA
1199 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2005 : 10:20:29 AM
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I have a 4 by 8 foot bed that I dug using the chinese method of grdening which I intend to extend. The first bed was an experimental bed and has served quite well. It is similar to the 4 foot method but instead of enclosing the raised bed in a box you simply double dig the bed once, remove all of the rocks, sift the soil back into the bed adding several yards of ammendment to bring it to a good ph for what you want to grow. The paths between the beds are simply a 3 or 4 foot wide grassy path or you can lay down flagstones if you want. the basic idea is to never again have to deep dig or rototill the beds. You never step on this bed and keeping its edges is a simple process of just edging along the edge once a year, shaking out the soil and stiring through the bed with your rake just before planting again. they end up being about 1 foot above the ground. you pat the edges firm and gently water only as much as necessary to keep the plants thriving. You also rotate the crops in these beds to keep pests and disease at bay. It works wonderfully, each year I add a layer of new compost and in the fall I lay on a layer of chopped straw. It is easy to work these beds earlier than the traditional bed as being raised it warms sooner. The soil is never hard again and by using liquid worm tea or manuer tea it is healthy. Worm tea by the way seems to be one of the best pest and disease fighters around.
Eileen
songbird; singing joy to the earth |
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jpbluesky
True Blue Farmgirl
6066 Posts
Jeannie
Florida
USA
6066 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2005 : 1:09:16 PM
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This is the way I garden all the time, and did not know it had a name. I have all raised beds, which yearly apply manure and compost to, and we keep the weeds out and never walk on them. My path between beds is brick tile that my husband laid out by setting all the tiles on diagonal so they look like diamond shapes. When the grass grows around them, the path never gets muddy. I build up my beds with imbedded 2 by 8 board edges in a rectangle of 4 x 8 and then I have made a light weight netting fence which I also put over the top if needed to keep the birds out. I have four of these beds and they work great. I like to put hanging baskets around the area, too, for my strawberry plants and additional cherry tomatoes. The only things that do not work as well in the raised beds are my cucumbers and zuchini, because they like to spread and crawl. But even then I train them to go up the fencing and they seem to like being off the ground.
I love these garden talks!
jpbluesky |
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bramble
True Blue Farmgirl
2044 Posts
2044 Posts |
Posted - Mar 18 2005 : 6:00:22 PM
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Nikki-Nice to hear from you and know that you are well but busy!
My sister in law gardens this way also and found the hardest part was the path maintenance until she put down pine needles from her trees as mulch. They are acidic enough to act as a weed seed germination inhibitor and pack nicely and smell great to walk on. It's a win- win situation!
My garden is similar but I have resorted to raised box beds (my husband was lucky enough to salvage some cedar from a job) so he built me 6 4'x4' boxes that I moved around for awhile until I got the placement just right. It's kind of like an old fashioned kitchen garden in those old colonial homes , except I have boxes instead of boxwood. We add our compost to them and turn them over before planting but it's been much easier to manage for me in recent years.
I tried pea gravel in the walkways but it was too froofy for me, now it's just mulch from our eco center. I have herbs and veggies coexisting quite nicely, and double crop almost every space and far fewer insect problems than when I did the big plot. Might be the aromatic cedar is a natural deterent! Might just be I'm further off the ground! Good luck, it's a great book with a lot of useful info
so...go for it!
with a happy heart |
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MeadowLark
True Blue Farmgirl
2206 Posts
USA
2206 Posts |
Posted - Mar 20 2005 : 3:36:19 PM
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Hi Nicki! Good topic...here are my pros and cons for what they are worth... Never use old railroad ties! I have and it is a disaster not to mention toxic from creasote that the ties are treated with...I have also used pressure treated lumber but now that is off the market because of formaldyhide...so what's a farmgirl to do to edge the beds??? You can use the new plastic wierd wood stuff now available, old untreated lumber that will rot, or stone, concrete blocks, or bagged quickcrete that you stack and when it gets wet will make concrete round blocks( my personal favorite). There is concrete dyes available that will make them look more "natural". For ease and looks though wood still is best...like cedar. This spring I am redoing my beds using the quikcrete and some natural stone. I grow roses, herbs, flowers and a few veggies this way. I still prefer my tomatoes, beans, peppers, squash, cucumbers right into the ground.
I did a different thing with my daughters old, generous sandbox made out of lumber. Moved it on an angle to the center of my little fenced garden, painted it and the girls decorated it by painting bugs, flowers,ect on it. Filled it with manure and soil on top of the sand and planted some roses and lilies and herbs in it. A recycled sandbox now used for a raised flower bed! Paths are the playground tough grass turf...never gets weeds and is very thick and soft.
"Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I'll meet you there." Rumi, 13th century. |
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jpbluesky
True Blue Farmgirl
6066 Posts
Jeannie
Florida
USA
6066 Posts |
Posted - Mar 21 2005 : 06:19:49 AM
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Sandbox turned raised flower bed - great idea! I bet it looks really pretty.
jpbluesky
Love those big blue skies and wide open spaces. |
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sonflowergurl
True Blue Farmgirl
349 Posts
Katee
Tampa 'Burbs
FL
USA
349 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2006 : 6:46:43 PM
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I am reviving this thread because I found the site earlier today. I'm thinking about making a 4x8 area to do SFG in, would you suggest 1)making a true box with a "floor" or 2)digging out the sod (grass) and making "Mel's Mix" of soil stuff on top of the existing dirt? Our soil is very sandy and hard (clay too), and grass is a little sparse in some places just because the soil isn't very fertile (at least it seems that way).
Anyway, any advice/ideas would be appreciated. My son just told me that the house being built caddy-corner from us (behind) has a big construction dumpster full of wood that would be perfect for this. We might have to go "scrounging" tomorrow! LOL
Katee
The end will justify the pain it took to get us here.
"Looking Toward the Son"---- http://sonflowergirl731.blogspot.com
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therusticcottage
True Blue Farmgirl
4439 Posts
Kay
Vancouver
WA
USA
4439 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2006 : 8:46:16 PM
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Katee -- I did square foot gardening when I had my house in town. I had clay soil with lots of river rock -- hardpan down about 4 inches. I used concrete blocks laid on their sides with the holes facing up for my 4 x 4 beds. I only did one layer high which was 8 inches but you could certainly do two layers if you wanted it deeper. I dug down about 4 inches, roughed up the soil, then laid the blocks. This equaled a 12 inch depth for the soil when I was done. Then filled with soil mix from a local nursery. I even filled the holes and planted flowers in them. But wood would work great too. The reason I chose concrete was that it would last indefinitely -- wood has to be replace eventually. I did each bed for about $25. This is a fabulous way to garden -- very easy!
http://therusticcottage.etsy.com
http://www.homesteadblogger.com/therusticcottage/
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sonflowergurl
True Blue Farmgirl
349 Posts
Katee
Tampa 'Burbs
FL
USA
349 Posts |
Posted - Apr 29 2006 : 05:49:02 AM
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I like the idea of using cinder blocks (especially since you can add flowers in the holes, great idea!), but we're renting and I don't want to do anything "too" permanent. Our landlord said we could do anything landscaping-wise to the yard we wanted, but if the next people don't want a garden, I guess it'd be best to have it easily removed too. I just figured "free wood" would be a good start. LOL
My 11 year-old son told me he'd like to help with a garden, so I think this would be a fairly easy way to get him excited about it. My daughter (6 y/o) is already trying to "plant" every seed she comes across. Just yesterday she was eating grapes and took the seeds outside and planted them somewhere. LOL (I wonder how that will turn out...) Now she's looking at a book about "Dirt" from the school library and wants to plant some more grape seeds in a way shown in the book. We should have some interesting things growing in strange places soon, I'm sure! haha
Katee
The end will justify the pain it took to get us here.
"Looking Toward the Son"---- http://sonflowergirl731.blogspot.com
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Alaska farm girl
True Blue Farmgirl
123 Posts
dorothy
skagway
Alaska
USA
123 Posts |
Posted - Apr 29 2006 : 09:19:42 AM
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| I did raised beds last year! We built them with 2x8's. First i took out the sod,(the beds are 4 ft. wide).The sod was cut into 1-1\2 ft. sections.Make sure you only take the weed stuff(the top 4" here).This just helps keep the weeds from growing up alot sooner. The bottom boards need to be set into the ground about 6" deep(so the grass won't grow into the beds). Then we set the top boards on.This just makes it nice for sitting on and keeping our rowdy dog out! There are 4x4 posts (16") in the corners to screw into.The sod can be stacked,grass to grass,, in the back yard.It can be used later,(1-2 yrs.)after it has broken down.Don't use treated wood. |
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Alaska farm girl
True Blue Farmgirl
123 Posts
dorothy
skagway
Alaska
USA
123 Posts |
Posted - Apr 30 2006 : 07:04:42 AM
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| Yesterday,my son(5) walked up to me and hugged me and said Mommy,you smell good,you smell like dirt! I had been digging post holes all day and was exhausted so that put some spark back in my brain and body.Also hubby took us out to eat!!! |
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Celticheart
True Blue Farmgirl
811 Posts
Marcia
WA
USA
811 Posts |
Posted - Apr 30 2006 : 7:48:20 PM
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I haven't tried SFG yet but I plan to this year(as soon as we move in 3 weeks--still plenty of time). I want to combine this method with Lasagna Gardening in raised beds. Have any of you tried that?
Marcia
"I suppose the pleasure of country life lies really in the eternally renewed evidence of the determination to live." Vita Sackville-West
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Mari-dahlia
True Blue Farmgirl
269 Posts
Marianne
Hoosick Falls
New York
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - May 01 2006 : 05:47:48 AM
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| I like my row veggies in raised beds most. When they are planted throughout an area, I find them much easier to weed and when they get larger, there is little to no weeding. |
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Libbie
Farmgirl Connection Cultivator
3579 Posts
Anne E.
Elsinore
Utah
USA
3579 Posts |
Posted - May 03 2006 : 08:49:57 AM
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I'm not really familiar with square foot gardening, and I was looking on Amazon.com at the books. It seems like Mel Bartholomew has written several - which one do you all recommend for the best information if I just can purchase one?
XOXO, Libbie
"Nothing is worth more than this day." - Goethe |
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akcowgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
296 Posts
Valerie
Homer
Alaska
USA
296 Posts |
Posted - May 04 2006 : 1:16:25 PM
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yah what books are you guys using. i am very interested in this also.
Valerie
Yes, I live in my own little world. But that's ok they know me here.
Deja Moo: The feeling that you've heard this bull before.
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lvg4him
Farmgirl in Training
34 Posts
Colorado
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - May 07 2006 : 4:27:59 PM
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I second using the All New Square Foot Gardening book http://www.squarefootgardening.com . I took a look at SFG a few years back when I thought about gardening. It looked too difficult for me. But after reading the ANSFG, I am so excited about gardening! Of course hubby wants to wait until next year to do it (as we are hoping to move soon) and he doesn't want to waste the time and money in something we will be leaving behind.
I am so excited about gardening this way! Our soil here in CO is AWFUL for growing things in. But you make Mel's Mix and you don't have to mix in and use your old soil. You don't have to test for pH (or even know what pH is!). And once you buy the initial ingredients (you can get at any garden shop and don't have to buy through him), then you only have to keep adding compost to it (and he tells you how to make your own compost!). I plan on doing this next year with the weed deterant "carpet" MaryJane talks about in her book (can't remember what it was, but it is in the gardening section of her book and I am too pregnant - 4 days overdue - to go and peak in my book - sorry).
He also has the idea of using 3'x3' for children AND his web site sells a homeschooling lesson plan to go along with SFG for those of you who homeschool. I have not gotten it yet as my oldest is only 6. |
Edited by - lvg4him on May 07 2006 4:28:39 PM |
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Celticheart
True Blue Farmgirl
811 Posts
Marcia
WA
USA
811 Posts |
Posted - May 07 2006 : 7:03:01 PM
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I bought the SFG book last year and am going to try it this year as soon as we move =~) I also highly recommend the Lasagna Gardening book. http://www.lasagnagardening.com
Happy gardening,
Marcia
"I suppose the pleasure of country life lies really in the eternally renewed evidence of the determination to live." Vita Sackville-West
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Libbie
Farmgirl Connection Cultivator
3579 Posts
Anne E.
Elsinore
Utah
USA
3579 Posts |
Posted - May 08 2006 : 5:27:09 PM
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Thanks for the book recommendations! I'm going to check them out and perhaps change to this type of gardening. It just sounds so interesting. I've never heard of lasagna gardening, either, and am anxious to look at that. Well.... off to the websites!
XOXO, Libbie
"Nothing is worth more than this day." - Goethe |
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therusticcottage
True Blue Farmgirl
4439 Posts
Kay
Vancouver
WA
USA
4439 Posts |
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brightmeadow
True Blue Farmgirl
2045 Posts
Brenda
Lucas
Ohio
USA
2045 Posts |
Posted - May 09 2006 : 5:09:31 PM
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I loved the Mel Bartholomew book also, and was very inspired by it. It seemed very logical and neat, and I loved the idea of progessive gardening that he talked about.
At my old house I built 10 4x8 foot beds from scrap lumber I salvaged from a greenhouse that was being torn down. (A couple of beds I edged with brick, rock, and concrete pieces because I ran out of lumber.) I built the garden over lawn. Then, as now, I refused to use Roundup, so killed the grass by smothering it with newspaper/mulch, and the dirt in the beds. I left the area between the beds in grass.
I did have a huge problem with weeds in the beds the second and third years. Especially one area where I had Canada thistle, and another where the grass just wouldn't give up. I actually got desperate enough to use Roundup on the thistles, the Roundup only wounded it, it didn't kill it, and the stupid thing sent out runners up to 20 feet away in a big circle - I had thistles everywhere. I used my little Mantis tiller right in the beds but found with the lumber edging the beds, it was difficult to till right up to the edges and I had to do that by hand. It was also difficult to mow the grass between the beds because I didn't own a good gas-powered string trimmer and it was too far from the house for the extension cord to reach, so I had long grass right next to the beds - dripping their seed heads right over my vegetables.
I had a good harvest, but the garden looked like H**L. The neighbors laughed at me. My DH, who was then my fiance, finally made me pull all the boards out and he brought over a tractor and big tiller and tilled it all up and we planted grass seed for the new owners.
Now, I plant a traditional rowed garden. I happily allow my husband to till the garden two or three times in the spring using a tractor and then the Troy-bilt. It takes him a fraction of the time, and I get lots fewer blisters and calluses. Because of the more frequent tillings I get a lot fewer weeds and it is easier to incorporate organic matter like leaf mulch or compost into the garden. I then just use my Mantis for seed bed preparation.
Just my preference, either way I would NEVER give up gardening!
You shall eat the fruit of the labor of your hands - You shall be happy and it shall be well with you. -Psalm 128.2
Visit my web site store at http://www.watkinsonline.com/fish or my homepage at http://home.earthlink.net/~brightmeadow |
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Heather in GA
Farmgirl in Training
13 Posts
Heather
Georgia
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - May 10 2006 : 08:56:04 AM
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This is my first year doing the square foot garden. As was stated above ... it's ugly  (I made mine exactly like he outlines in the new book) but it's working well. One thing I don't understand, however (and perhaps I just need to learn more about gardening) is that my plants (especially my beans and tomatoes) are yellow green instead of green (like my other tomatoes are that are not in the square foot garden). I'm not sure why other than the "soil"? I dunno ... but next year I might just make a good old fashioned row garden 
BTW I am homeschooling and have a newborn too so the SFG was easy on me this year [8D |
Edited by - Heather in GA on May 10 2006 08:58:20 AM |
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Phils Ann
True Blue Farmgirl
1095 Posts
Ann
Parsonsburg
Maryland
USA
1095 Posts |
Posted - May 12 2006 : 5:49:16 PM
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Hi to you all! I have had tilled row gardens for the most part, using manure and compost... and then this spring ordered a book, Gardening When It Counts, by Steve Solomon (who started Territorial Seed CO.). He does advocate raised beds, but teaches how to garden for optimal nutrients, using less irrigation. We were able to get ingredients for the "complete organic fertilizer" he believes to be best at our local farm supply store. His style is fun, but he's a serious gardener with a whole lot of experience, who's had to learn to garden in order to have enough to eat... I don't usually get carried away like this but as you can see, I'm excited and have to share about his book!
Phil's Ann
There is a Redeemer. |
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lvg4him
Farmgirl in Training
34 Posts
Colorado
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - May 15 2006 : 08:50:04 AM
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| The All New SFG is MUCH prettier (check out tthe web site). It is also weed free (he changed a lot of things from the old way it was done). |
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lamarguerite farm
True Blue Farmgirl
649 Posts
missy
Battle Ground
Wa
USA
649 Posts |
Posted - May 15 2006 : 7:53:25 PM
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We just put in 8 4x4 beds this weekend. I have herbs in two of them and the rest have vegetable seeds planted. It only took the cats one day to start using them as a litter box and I was wondering if any of you have had this problem and if you have any suggestions. I chased one of them off with the hose tonight and I think I hurt his feelings. He sat sulking in the trees while I watered and normally he is right at my feet. I know they are just being cats but it's really frustrating!!
Blessings,
Missy
If you have a dream, even if you don't feel qualified to accomplish it, just try your hardest.-Maggie Jensen
http://18happyhens.blogspot.com
http://LamargueriteFarm.etsy.com |
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Aunt Jenny
True Blue Farmgirl
11381 Posts
Jenny
middle of
Utah
USA
11381 Posts |
Posted - May 15 2006 : 11:01:47 PM
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Didn't know there WAS an all new SFG. DAng. I am still using my old one from 15 years ago. It is pretty weathered and beat up..I should have bought a new one..next year for sure. We WERE going to do raised beds (Mittelieder method) but figured out that it would cost a fortune to fill them...so we are doing square foot in our existing soil..enriched with 3 years of goat and sheep poop. The kids and I got two types of peppers ...18 plants, 12 broccoli, 6 cauliflower and 6 cabbage plants and one hill of yellow crooked neck squash planted today. I am afraid to put out my tomato plants yet..although it has been really hot..in the 80's for the past few days. I may bite the bullet and do it tommorrow. I think I will keep a few in the house just in case though. We can get a hard freeze until the end of May. I know that would wipe out the peppers too. YOungest daughter and I came in really dirty after our gardening tonight...and loved it!! We have about a 16x40 ft area that we will do all in square foot. We took apart the boxes we had built for raised beds and are using the boards (2x12's) for paths and edges. It looks real nice. We have to buy more boards but it will be way cheaper still than buying all the perlite and peat moss and all that we would have had to buy to fill the 4 16x4 ft boxes we had built. I like the nice neat look of this.
Jenny in Utah
Inside me there is a skinny woman crying to get out...but I can usually shut her up with cookies
http://www.auntjennysworld.blogspot.com/ visit my little online shop at www.auntjenny.etsy.com |
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Garden Gate: Square Foot Gardening |
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Square Foot Gardening
