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Across the Fence:  The Secret  |
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oceanfarmgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
231 Posts
Rachel
A Little Closer to Heaven
Oregon Coast
USA
231 Posts |
 Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 12:08:24 PM
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I think that the point of this book is not if you want ANYTHING to visualize it. Rather, from My understanding, it's that if you have LIFE GOALS, (ie: a FARM) that visualizing it can help you get to it. It's a proven FACT the self fulfilling prophecy (sp) is real. People who don't think highly of themselves don't excell... People who want something but don't think they are worthy, rarely GET what they dream of. Because they don't move FORWARD toward the goal. The Secret shares a method of creating a self fulfilling prophecy. By thinking positivly, and visualizing your goal, you help your brain create the drive to keep you in motion toward your goal. Whether you are christian or not has nothing to do with it. It's about reaching a goal. This book claims to have the key to maximising (sp) your chances of reaching a goal. It's not about having EVERY LITTLE THING handed to you on a platter. It's not about taking your life out of God's hands and into your own. As a Christian, you can use the secret and ask God to help you find THE GOAL that is within His will for your life.
I don't understand why everylittle thing here has to come down to blows between everyone.
~rachel
See what I'm up to on my blog... http://minetothine.blogspot.com
OR check out my gardening activities at http://oceanfarmgirlsgarden.blogspot.com |
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 12:16:36 PM
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| Berated? Did I miss something? I thought we're just farmgirls who see things from different angles, all chiming in with our various ideas on an interesting subject. |
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ArmyWifey
True Blue Farmgirl
712 Posts
Holly
Abilene
KS
712 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 12:22:47 PM
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I don't think it's coming to blows at all...... I know I'm not offended.
I got on to add that I don't have a problem at all with having a vision or a vision statement -- write it down, pray about it and work towards it --- the Bible does say that "the people perish because there is no vision" however I don't think that means that simply by visualizing things the universe is somehow obligated to give it to you. In the intial post it was stated that this theory applies to anything you want at all so that's what I was addressing in the previous post.
I think as with other things in life there needs to be a balance between looking to the future and making things better (hoping for a farm,etc) and being content/thankful for what you have now. I know I need to write down our vision for our family and possibly a farm, pray over whether it lines up with God's will AND make list of what I'm grateful for now.
thanks,
Holly
As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord!
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 12:32:21 PM
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Now then, back to the topic. <ahem>
It seems to me that prayer is a kind of visualization, a way to focus on one's need while asking for the essence of fulfillment to manifest itself somehow -- whether by a divine hand in some way we can't imagine, or by our own hands, once our concentration on the matter has allowed us to see what we need to do next.
I mean, you can pray for a better job, or stick pins in candles for the same boon all you want, according to your belief system, and those things may well set a supportive force in motion on your behalf if you do it faithfully and with respect for all who might be affected by your action, but nothing beats updating your resume and knocking on doors. (Libby might suggest a new lipstick for a little private hurrah.) I believe the Christan saying, "God helps those who help themselves" covers it very nicely. |
Edited by - Rosemary on Mar 02 2007 2:05:24 PM |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 12:58:14 PM
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Patti you misunderstood what I said. I am at a loss why you feel I am denying your faith in this world? I normally make it a point to never talk about faith because it seems to end up in a battle of words to defend the reality someone is experiencing. There is no wrong or right - I thought we were not to sit in judgement of others. I guess I should have listened to my inner voice and not attempted to share my view. Forgive me.
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com |
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Amie C.
True Blue Farmgirl
2099 Posts
Finger Lakes Region
NY
2099 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 1:00:52 PM
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| Rachel, the way you describe it, visualizing what you want as a way to keep yourself moving towards it seems much more practical than I gave it credit for. I'm just responding to the hype about the book, of course, since I haven't read it. I admit, I have a knee-jerk negative reaction to pop movements that encourage people to believe they can get whatever they want by thinking about it the right way. I run into it a lot, from Christians and from secular people as well. In Christian circles, it gets expressed as the belief that God will give you what you pray for if you are sincere enough, or that God will heal your illness if your belief is strong enough . It bothers me, because the flip side of that is the attitude that when someone fails to accomplish what they were trying for, then we can shrug off their dismay and pain. They weren't trying hard enough, they didn't *really* want it enough, their faith wasn't strong enough. I think that's just the American way, really. Our culture is based on progress, success, and expansion. Failure is the worst sin you can commit. I wish that, as a society, we had more tools for coping with failure, both in ourselves and others. |
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jpbluesky
True Blue Farmgirl
6066 Posts
Jeannie
Florida
USA
6066 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 1:20:14 PM
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My apologies for the word berated in my earlier post on this topic. Intimidated, maybe. I did not intend to begin this long discussion! :) Anywhoo, I am thankful we all can express our thoughts freely, and they are very intelligent thoughts, too. My earlier comment stemmed from the thought that I listen to others beliefs and honor their freedom to say them, and yet I sometimes feel a wall go up if I express mine about believing in Christ. For those of you who believe in other ways, do you feel this wall too when you talk about what you believe?
Ephesians 1:17 |
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 1:41:51 PM
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Yes, I do feel that wall get put up, but only by Christians, if you want to know the truth.
It can be a little -- to use your word -- intimidating to be surrounded by people who practice a religion they feel is absolutely true, no argument need apply, and that's fine for them. What irks me is when they make so many assumptions about its value to others.
Right here on this message board, many of my fellow farmgirls have Biblical quotations or almost aggressively Christian sentiments as their signatures, so I can't avoid facing this undercurrent of difference no matter what topic I choose to read. Maybe I'm too sensitive, but it gets a little oppressive sometimes.
I have yet to discuss my religion with a Christian who didn't start in trying to convert me, or try to have me believe they felt put-upon for their beliefs, while I have studied their religion in its many variations with great interest, asking respectful questions that I might better understand their thinking. In fact, I have one Christian friend who says she would come to me first with scriptural questions before she'd go to her pastor, simply because I've given the subject more thought and he seems to be taken up mostly with fund-raising.
But whatcha gonna do? I have one commandment: Do no harm. Under that rule, it's not my business to ask anyone to tone down the proselytizing. In fact, I'd be the first one picking up a sign at the First Amendment rights rally to demand they be allowed the freedom to do it. But that doesn't mean it doesn't drive me nuts sometimes!
I hope that in being honest about this, I've cut a window into that wall just a little bit. That's my intention, anyway. Let the fresh air flow. |
Edited by - Rosemary on Mar 02 2007 2:19:27 PM |
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Patsy
True Blue Farmgirl
592 Posts
Illinois
USA
592 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 3:20:14 PM
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From what I understand about the secret is that you need to be grateful for what you have. This will attract other things for you to be grateful for. I have been practicing this for about two years (before I ever heard of The Secret). And you know, it seems to work. I can be worried about something and then get ahold of myself and be grateful for everything else and realize I am right where I am supposed to be. Then...boom...all of a sudden the answer to the worry litteraly falls in my lap. It is just amazing. Lately, it has been happening like that more and more. And every night, no matter what happened during the day, I say a prayer and say thank you, thank you, thank you.
I am a big fan of Wayne Dyer and he has been talking about this for a long time. That is where I got the idea that we are all exactly where we are supposed to be. And to be grateful for whatever comes our way. All lessons to be learned.
P.S. I am a Christian and don't find any conflict at all in this. I know God put me here to learn lessons and He maps my experiences. I have the option to CHOOSE how I react to them. And He did not put me on this earth to be miserable.
Blessed are those who love the soil,
Patsy
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 3:44:24 PM
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Patsy, I think you're right, though we might approach the same conclusion via different paths. The idea that like attracts like is an ancient one. In many folk traditions, including some Christian ones, it manifests as "sympathetic magic." Others say if you want love to come into your life, be loving.
It can be a powerful thing to embrace our gifts and rid ourselves of what the Buddhists say is the great disabler of human souls: desire. I don't mean sexual desire, or other primal desires (like to be safe from harm, to have enough to eat, and so on) but what comedian Stephen Colbert might call "wantiness" -- the motive that makes kids whine at the Mall. This disabling emotion blinds us to the possibilities freely to hand, distracts us from living in healthier space, and is a frequent cause of misery in our lives.
That's not to say we should just stand still and let Fate, or God, do all the work of living for us. As in so many things, the trick is finding balance. |
Edited by - Rosemary on Mar 02 2007 6:37:24 PM |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 3:52:03 PM
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Thank yo so much Rosemary and Patsy. You managed to speak those words that echo my heart. I will share one example of how I have experienced "The Secret". This is not a new concept for millions of us who also do not want to be silenced. For years my husband and I would sit in bed at night and he would say "We are sitting in our log house with the wind blowing outside and the animals all tucked in and safe for the night". This was said every night since we married in 1982. He and I never lived on a farm, he never even had a goldfish growing up. He was a city boy but for some reason this was our long off dream. When he passed away 11 years ago he never saw our dream come true. In the months following his passing I kept to the knowing that all life has meaning even when you can not find the good. Each day my boys and I would state what we were greatefull for even if was that we got thru another day. My large show home became unbearable during the day when my boys were at school, so I found myself many days just driving the country roads and crying buckets of tears wondering which way to turn with two young boys and no real compass other then my inner knowning that the path would show itself. I got turned around on the backroads one day and pulled my truck to the side of the road because the tears would not stop. I settled myself and reminded myself their is a purpose for everything. When I dried my tears and could focus my eyes - what did I see? A log home on 35 acres with a For Sale sign. I pull in their drive and walked up to their door and knocked. The young couple planned to leave for Africa to do their Gods work and was at the end of their rope because no one wanted their home. I asked them what they where selling it for, asked to use their phone, called my long time broker and told him to start the paperwork that day. In one week the log home was mine and I placed my home for sale. Now each night I know that what I put my attention on does come to pass. Not always the way we design it but I am living proof of it.
I too also have every book, tape and lecture of Dr Dyer along with his holiness the Dalai Lama, Pema Chodron, Ram Dass, Don Miguel Ruiz, the teaching of the Tao and the Bible. I have never feared learning about someone's beliefs nor do I judge them. I am at a loss why the exchange of different beliefs is so threating to those who profess to be so religious?
I send only the wish that you can see the goodness in everyone even if they do not believe in the same "God".
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com |
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laluna
True Blue Farmgirl
295 Posts
New York
USA
295 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 5:44:28 PM
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@Rosemary - your statements about "intimidation" rang true to me. The issue for me is not whether there should be a discourse on the messageboard that allows all viewpoints. That seems to be a given that we all agree upon. It is, however, the way in which these opinions are often expressed. It seems that those of us "less-devout" and/or "non-Christians" tend to preface our comments with a "this is my opinion" kind of statement, whereas many of the "fundamentalists" tend to be more aggressive in their statements, as if they were fact (e.g. "well of course god created the universe", etc.) Perhaps a bit more gentle, yet still precise, use of language is in order here?
@Grace - I had the great fortune of going to see and hear the Dalai Lama speak at one of our local universities this past fall. What a wonderful, humble, loving man. It was an experience I will carry with me for the rest of my life. And I echo your wish of goodness in and for all :-) |
Edited by - laluna on Mar 02 2007 5:46:32 PM |
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owwlady
True Blue Farmgirl
899 Posts
Jan
Tomahawk
WI
USA
899 Posts |
Posted - Mar 02 2007 : 7:09:46 PM
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| Oh Grace, I felt like crying when I read your post...how sad that your husband wasn't there to live the dream with you, but how wonderful that you found it...I've seen Wayne Dyer on tv and I've tried reading his books, but I get lost in them...I keep thinking I'll pick one up at the library again and give it another try...I first heard of him through the Anthony Robbins book "The Giant Within"...I have a feeling that The Secret is probably a lot like the Robbins book...I learned a lot through that and the Rhonda Britten book, (can't remember the title, something about 30 Days) Her book really helped change my life around...gave me a new perspective on how my negative self-talk was so destructive...hey, we're all in this together, trying to live a good life, trying to do the right things...I'm just glad to have all of you as friends to do it with... |
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Leezard
True Blue Farmgirl
950 Posts
Elizabeth
Novi
MI
USA
950 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2007 : 07:27:42 AM
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I agree with you there Rachel (oceanfarmgirl). And as a Christian I can see how this kind of thinking can be an extension of your faith. Why can't God be your "secret"? Yes, the idea may be that you're working toward something but that's how it is with God too, He doesn't do all the work or none of us would get anywhere. I talked a little about this with my dad who is quite a religious fellow and he seemed to think that the premis isn't all that bad. Why can't this idea be something that works with your faith in God?
As others have said, this isn't about getting everything you want but visualizing a dream-going back to school, getting the job you want, taking that dream vacation, buying the house you love-and knowing that you're worthy of that dream and working hard to make it happen. They also talk about accepting the bad with the good, that life isn't all you want it to be but it's the bad things (along with the good) that make us who we are. I think that in order to fully understand this idea it's important to read the book because when you don't it's easy to judge it and come up with sensational ideas about it without really knowing what it's about. That being said, I haven't read it yet but I am on the waiting list to get it from the library and am looking forward to understanding it better.
http://ruby--slippers.blogspot.com/
www.leezard.etsy.com |
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2007 : 09:16:04 AM
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| Maybe it's just all about commitment. How we choose to generate it is almost beside the point. When our will is set in motion toward a goal, and believe (or know) that supportive forces are helping us, we're more open to recognizing when we're close to reaching it. It's then just a matter of reaching out: for the phone, to shake hands, to embrace, or (if what we're committed to is ending a destructive lifestyle) even running like hell toward that suddenly visible "Exit" sign. |
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ArmyWifey
True Blue Farmgirl
712 Posts
Holly
Abilene
KS
712 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2007 : 10:14:59 AM
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by the by.... the saying "God helps those who help themselves" may be a idiom but it is NOT in the Bible. Just so you know.
and in reality is against what His word says -- as we are to rely on God for everything. God isn't looking to us to do our part and THEN He will do His -- He doesn't play with His people that way.
Blessings!
Holly
As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord!
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Edited by - ArmyWifey on Mar 03 2007 10:17:34 AM |
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2007 : 11:58:11 AM
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| Thanks for mentioning that, Holly. I know the expression doesn't come from the Bible. Surprisingly, there are a lot of expressions with Christian character that don't, and many very secular-sounding ones that do! I guess a lot of what goes into which column depends on how you approach and interpret scripture, and there are myriad ways to do that -- one reason why there are hundreds of Christian denominations in the world today. That's a fascinating subject for another day. |
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Persephone
True Blue Farmgirl
172 Posts
Katrina
Indiana
USA
172 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2007 : 12:15:44 PM
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Well, in the first thread about this, I said I wanted to do some more research into this from a Biblical perspective, and I haven't had a chance to do a whole lot of that (having a destructive toddler is rather a hindrance to deep Biblical study- typing too, for that matter. :) But I have thought of a few- I think part of the problem is not understanding the "Secret" too. I'd like for more people to chime in with how they interpret the meaning of The Secret. My understanding of it is that it's about not focusing on negativity, but positivity. That can be seen in the verse in Philippians about thinking about good, pure, true, etc. You don't think about what you DON"T want to happen, you think about what you DO want to happen. The other verse that's going through my head in regards to the Secret is "Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness. And all these things shall be added unto you." I think that's another way of saying it, from a Biblical POV. Now, I can't say I've looked all these verses up, considered their context, considered the historical context, and done a check on the original language meanings of words (which is what I always do when I truly want to understand something in the Bible), but if anyone would like to do that and post about it, I'd be interested.
In regards to the distinction between Christians and others, I'd like to say that for me, I am unashamedly a Christian, and while not wishing to shove that down anyone's throats, also do not wish to hide it, and since my whole world view is from a Christian perspective, you may hear some Bible verses or Christian saying out of me from time to time. That's part of who I am. I personally, embrace diversity, and would love to learn about other's religions. I have made it a point to study Judaism, and Pagan earth based traditions, because I hang out around those kinds of people a lot. While there may be conflicting beliefs in our religions, I think we can be tolerant of those with conflicting beliefs. After all, the biggest message Jesus taught was love. I think that Christians have lost sight of that BIG time. |
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Rosemary
True Blue Farmgirl
1825 Posts
Virginia
USA
1825 Posts |
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Love-in-a-Mist
True Blue Farmgirl
367 Posts
Shannon
Independence
Oregon
USA
367 Posts |
Posted - Mar 03 2007 : 7:13:47 PM
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After reading what Ocean Girl said about it, it makes more sense to me. I can appreciate it more now. I still don't believe it is forces of the universe, though. It's your own attitude.
I think Christianity is intimitading, because it is written as absolute truth and if you choose not to believe it or live a different way there are reprocutions(sp). You can feel like your being attacked and like you have to defend yourself. I don't mean to start so many heated discussions, I have been learning alot about Christianity lately and am very passionate about it. I'm going to start blogging that way I won't "journal" on here as much. I find myself doing that and it causes alot issues. That way if you want my opinion you can come to my blog. I will try not to be so controversial on here anymore. I think this should be a good fun place for everyone to come.
Farmgirl and mother of 2
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Leezard
True Blue Farmgirl
950 Posts
Elizabeth
Novi
MI
USA
950 Posts |
Posted - Mar 04 2007 : 11:27:55 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by ArmyWifey
by the by.... the saying "God helps those who help themselves" may be a idiom but it is NOT in the Bible. Just so you know.
and in reality is against what His word says -- as we are to rely on God for everything. God isn't looking to us to do our part and THEN He will do His -- He doesn't play with His people that way.
Blessings!
Holly
I guess, based on what I'm reading you write here and feel free to correct me if what I read is wrong, I disagree with you. I do believe that we have to do our part in this life...now that doesn't mean we have to do something in order for God to do anything. In my opinion God is there, He's always there and He's always got my best intrests in mind. That doesn't mean that I don't have to work hard to make things happen in my life though and in relation to this Secret idea that I don't have to be positive and do some foot work to make my dreams happen. Yes, God guides my life and helps things to happen but everything I dream of-as in my career, my family life, vacations I want to take, etc.-take hard work on my part.
I don't know if I misunderstood what you were trying to say Holly so feel free to expand on your comments if you feel I've not understood.
http://ruby--slippers.blogspot.com/
www.leezard.etsy.com |
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westernhorse51
True Blue Farmgirl
1681 Posts
michele
farmingdale
n.j.
USA
1681 Posts |
Posted - Mar 05 2007 : 06:07:24 AM
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I've been on this forum since 2004 and we have NEVER had a problem expressing ourselves. Everyone has a right to their opinion. The difference I see NOW as to THEN is this; farmgirls would and could express themselves without fear of attack. We had many discussions on many hot topics but always had respect for each other. After reading these 4 pages it seems to me that maybe a bit of that is lacking. Everyone feels equally strong in their beliefs & opinions but I think the "delivery" makes a big difference. Please lets keep the respect for one another flowing, we can disagree but we can also do it w/ kindness. Thats what this place has always been about.
she selects wool and flax and works with eager hands Prov.31:13 |
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Clare
True Blue Farmgirl
2173 Posts
NC WA State
USA
2173 Posts |
Posted - Mar 05 2007 : 06:52:58 AM
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I have refrained from commenting, but to Michele's thoughts, I will add two four word phrases:
We are all ONE.
There is only ONE.
And in closing, from my practice this week:
The Divine shows up daily through you. Don't get in its way.
Humor is the prelude to faith and Laughter is the beginning of prayer. -- Reinhold Niebuhr
I want to be an "outrageous" old woman who never gets called an old lady. I want to be wiser, resonate love & peace and be earth-colored, till I fade away from pure joy!
http://farmstyle.blogspot.com
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Edited by - Clare on Mar 05 2007 06:54:02 AM |
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ArmyWifey
True Blue Farmgirl
712 Posts
Holly
Abilene
KS
712 Posts |
Posted - Mar 06 2007 : 1:00:42 PM
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Liz,
What I mean is this.... without God you can't even get up in the morning or take your next breath. He's the one in charge of when you live, how long, etc. The Bible says that He says" you can do nothing without me" (parphrase out of John) therefore we can live our lives as we want and in our own strength yes, but in the end it will all be futile because we are trying to live under our own strength and not His. Life will not have the meaning or abundance that it would if we were trusting Him and living through His strength.
Of course we have a choice as to our attitude, etc I'm not saying you just sit back and do nothing BUT we tend to get caught up in thinking we will only talk to Him when we need Him instead of about everything.
Hope that helps clarify where I'm coming from.
Clear as mud?! ;)
Blessings,
Holly
As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord!
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westernhorse51
True Blue Farmgirl
1681 Posts
michele
farmingdale
n.j.
USA
1681 Posts |
Posted - Mar 07 2007 : 09:38:53 AM
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The book the "Secret", I read it last night at work, someone had it so I read it, not a very thick book. In my opinion ONLY, all this book is about is the power of positive thinking. Thats the big secret and a good one but something we all have inside us anyway. You know how negative breeds negative? Well this book says positive feelings bring positive results. Thats it! No big mystery. It was great reading, anything uplifting to me is great,it doesn't replace my Bible & I don't think it will replace anyones religion or whatever they practice, just good reading.
she selects wool and flax and works with eager hands Prov.31:13 |
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Across the Fence: The Secret |
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The Secret
