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Entrepreneurship:  Food license:>  |
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craftychick06
True Blue Farmgirl
71 Posts
Darlene
fennville
Mi
USA
71 Posts |
 Posted - Jul 16 2006 : 8:10:57 PM
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Well met with our dept of ag inspector!! What a disappointment that was!~! He told me to offer my jams and jellies in our little roadside market i have to have a corporation, hire an attorney, draw up a business plan?? change the name by his reccomendation, NO ONE WILL BUY ANYTHING TO EAT FROM SOMEONE NAMED chicken scratch farm@@ right!! that got me mad as i have painted up a sign and business cards for the produce and eggs, he told me that i have to make a list of ingredients and just how i plan on canning these jars and how many and list the steps to doin this, then i have to have a license which is goin to cost me roughly 200.00 a year, i dont plan on making that much inventory~~ the kitchen i am goin to use is costin me next to nothing to use and is very nice and licensed and is 2 miles from home. I just cant see all this investment and legal issues when i am only making a couple of baked goods a week and only a batch of jellies here and there using our produce and fruits.
GEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ didnt think there was that much to do. He said that Michigan is tough on home businessess and is cracking down on food especially. Even if i wanted to make a few for our stand i still have to have all of this!! HE stated he didnt want to discourage me but BOY he sure did that!! I told him that i just wanted to suplement my income from losing my full time job i dont have that to invest right now!
What a pain!!
**LIVE LIFE JOYFULLY** |
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lovejanet
True Blue Farmgirl
97 Posts
Janet
La Canada
California
USA
97 Posts |
Posted - Jul 16 2006 : 9:20:13 PM
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hi Darlene,
sorry to hear the ag inspector was such a dud!
i say if you really want to do this, take one step at time and somehow get the money? can you get investors or a loan? i know this is only supposed to be part-time but maybe it can become a real source of income. oh well, good luck, don't give up.
love, janet
http://www.lovejanet.typepad.com/ |
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abbasgurl
True Blue Farmgirl
1262 Posts
Rhonda
USA
1262 Posts |
Posted - Jul 16 2006 : 10:57:17 PM
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Oh Darlene! That is so discouraging! I have a bit of trouble believing some of it...you HAVE to be incorporated? You HAVE to draw up a business plan? Hire an attorney? List the canning steps? I've never heard of anything like this. Almost sounds like he was layin' it on thick to discourage you.
Question...who actually approves and issues food licences in your county? Here, in Indiana (Lake County), the county health inspector issues the actual license. Lake County is known for being tough (and REALLY corrupt) and even they only require that you work in a county inspected kitchen. Maybe check with the county health department or another small manufacturer in your area to see if this guy was for real.
I know it sounds funny, but if he is the guy who would oversee your operation, could it be that he just doen't want to "mess with" such a small operation?
I dunno, does this sound overboard to anyone else?
Good luck to you Darlene. Sure hope you can work this out.
Rhonda
...and I will sing at the top of my lungs, and I will dance, even if I'm the only one! |
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ThymeForEweFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
705 Posts
Robin
An organic farm in the forest in
Maine
USA
705 Posts |
Posted - Jul 17 2006 : 05:12:59 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by craftychick06
Well met with our dept of ag inspector!! What a disappointment that was!~! He told me to offer my jams and jellies in our little roadside market i have to have a corporation, hire an attorney, draw up a business plan??
I don't think so. It's not an ag inspector's job to tell you the legal aspects of your business as a whole.
quote:
change the name by his reccomendation, NO ONE WILL BUY ANYTHING TO EAT FROM SOMEONE NAMED chicken scratch farm@@ right!! that got me mad as i have painted up a sign and business cards for the produce and eggs,
That's only his opinion. Take it from where it comes. People buy food from a place called Wal-Mart. Chicken Scratch Farm is a lot catchier than Wal-Mart.
quote:
he told me that i have to make a list of ingredients and just how i plan on canning these jars and how many and list the steps to doin this,
Home processors have to follow the same ingredients law as big processors. People need to know what they're eating. You list the ingredients in order of most to least, by weight. There are probably requirements for the size of the font. I can't make my ingredients list so small that consumers can't read the wording.
The steps for processing don't go on the label. You'll probably have to keep a copy of the steps for every recipe (not batch) on file. I have to turn in my processing instructions with every recipe when I have it tested. I have to have each recipe tested (not batch) once. As long as the ingredients and steps don't change I never have to submit a recipe for testing again.
You might also have to keep a log of batches you make for sale. Each batch I make has to have a batch number. The number should appear on the label. If it doesn't, and I have a recall, I would have to recall every batch I ever made for sale.
quote:
then i have to have a license which is goin to cost me roughly 200.00 a year,
That's expensive. Maine's home food processing license is $10.
The license application is here: http://tinyurl.com/zgm49. I fill out only what is applicable to my business.
quote:
dont plan on making that much inventory~~ the kitchen i am goin to use is costin me next to nothing to use and is very nice and licensed and is 2 miles from home. I just cant see all this investment and legal issues when i am only making a couple of baked goods a week and only a batch of jellies here and there using our produce and fruits.
I don't think I'd bother because of the high expense of a license and small amount you want to make for sale. The profit on a jar of jam or loaf of bread is very small. It would take a lot of jars and loaves to make up the cost of your business expenses before you started to show a true profit. If you count in a sustainable wage your business pays you for your labor you're probably hard pressed to make any profit. That's discouraging.
quote:
GEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ didnt think there was that much to do. He said that Michigan is tough on home businessess and is cracking down on food especially. Even if i wanted to make a few for our stand i still have to have all of this!! HE stated he didnt want to discourage me but BOY he sure did that!! I told him that i just wanted to suplement my income from losing my full time job i dont have that to invest right now!
What a pain!!
I had the inspector here to certifiy my scales two years ago. He answered a lot of questions for me. He came through my kitchen and pointed out what I needed to change before he came back to inspect it for my license. I learned a lot. It's hard to supplement income with value-added products unless you're doing it full time. The profit per item is so low that you have to produce a lot to make a living. Could you do a batch or two at a time and buy more supplies as you go instead of making a big investment in jars and other supplies? I started with a few batches of each jam/jelly to be sure people would pay the price I have to charge to make a profit.
Just thought of this - You didn't mention water and septic tests. You might need to have those to be sure your water supply is considered safe. Mine have to be tested yearly.
Robin
www.thymeforewe.com
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LJRphoto
True Blue Farmgirl
760 Posts
Laura
Hickory Corners
MI
USA
760 Posts |
Posted - Jul 23 2006 : 09:24:06 AM
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The name change suggestion is just not even any of his business. That's just his opinion that HE wouldn't buy anything from you and he's just one person. Remember all those signs for outhouse water or whatever it was called up and down I-94?
The rest of it I believe. I've been trying to figure out how to pass an inspection to sell my extra eggs and Michigan really makes you jump through hoops. Just the fact that they don't post the requirements on the agricultural website and you have to write a letter and then they will mail them back to you and THEN you can figure out what changes you have to make and then you have to get an inspection... I really do think that Michigan is trying to discourage small farmers which makes no sense considering our economy at the moment.
As far as the incorporation requirements, that's for YOUR protection. If, God forbid, your product made someone sick it keeps them from being able to go after your personal assets (your house, your car, your savings account). It's to protect you from personal financial ruin. If someone were to sue you, they could only go after your corporation's assets. I'm not sure you absolutely have to have an attorney or if there are any do it yourself types of things out there but I think it would be worth having one look it over at least.
Personally, I think you would be better off just selling your produce since unprocessed produce is exempt from all of that nonsense in Michigan.
"I would feel more optimistic about a bright future for man if he spent less time proving that he can outwit Nature and more time tasting her sweetness and respecting her seniority." -E. B. White
http://www.betweenthecities.com/blog/ljr/
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Buttercup
True Blue Farmgirl
1433 Posts
Talitha
Vermont
USA
1433 Posts |
Posted - Jul 23 2006 : 8:52:16 PM
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Darlene,
I am so sorry he was so discouraging! But I totally agree with what Robin was saying. Instead of contacting the Ag guy, try the SBA (Small Business Admin) instead. Most states do not charge much, you NEVER have to be incorperated (though I would sugest it in case somebody desides to sue you, you wont loose everything) And incorperation papers can be downloaded often from websites or bought in a packet at Staples etc. I would look online at the SBA for MI and see what they have to say and contact one of their counselors (free of charge) and ask them. Here is a link for the office in Detroit, I am sure there are links here to offices maybe closer to you...
http://www.sba.gov/mi/
See what they have that can help. I have never heard of "having to have a lawyer" anywhere in th USA. Also, as far as the name...I think it is adorable and only YOU will determine if people will or wont buy from you, not the name. In Cannan Maine we had a place called the "Outhouse" of all things and we loved their food and went there often. Then there is the "Purple Cow" and their breakfast there was great! I think "Chicken Scratch Farm" is a great and cute and catchy name...use it and make it a name people love!!!
If you want to do this, I am sure there are ways and who knows, your name may be "the " name in jellies and jams one day soon!!! 
Hugz and hang in there!!!
"If we could maintain the wonder of childhood and at the same time grasp the wisdom of age, what wonder,what wisdom,what life would be ours" |
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KJD
True Blue Farmgirl
402 Posts
402 Posts |
Posted - Jul 24 2006 : 6:20:43 PM
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| My husband emailed me today saying a co-worker has a jewelry side-business and is having a party this weekend. She wants to order 2 dozen of my chocolate chunk cookies for her party and wants to know what I charge. Well, I make these cookies every week as part of a bunch of food I make weekly for a family friend's household. He is 88 years old and has Alzheimers, but is cared for at home, so I and another lady cook for the household each week. We make soups, etc., but I also make cookies. Here, at my home, we are so "cookied" out, I send extras off to work with my husband, son, wherever, because you can only eat so many chocolate chunk cookies! So, this co-worker of my husband's apparently likes them and wants me to make them for her party. I looked online for price ideas - one said .50 per cookie and another said $29.95 for 3 doz. I told my husband both these, and of course he wants me to charge higher - so maybe we're going to say $18/2 doz. Do y'all have any thoughts on this? |
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brightmeadow
True Blue Farmgirl
2045 Posts
Brenda
Lucas
Ohio
USA
2045 Posts |
Posted - Jul 24 2006 : 7:39:22 PM
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They must be really good cookies! Personally I would never pay $18 for 2 dozen cookies, I would make them myself first, but that's just me, and you should charge whatever the market will bear. If you've figured the cost of the ingredients plus your time, and a little extra for the electricity/fuel, etc. then probably $18 is not too far off the mark. It's not like you're making them in big quantities, I'm sure. If she orders 4 dozen then your pricing is OK (or maybe too low!) If she looks shocked and says no, then you know that's too much for your area.
You shall eat the fruit of the labor of your hands - You shall be happy and it shall be well with you. -Psalm 128.2
Visit my web site store at http://www.watkinsonline.com/fish or my homepage at http://home.earthlink.net/~brightmeadow |
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KJD
True Blue Farmgirl
402 Posts
402 Posts |
Posted - Jul 25 2006 : 2:21:25 PM
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| OK - my husband and I broke down the cost of ingredients for these cookies - around $6. So, I told the lady $7/dozen (the recipe makes a few dozen). Even though my husband, sister and brother in law were telling me $10/dozen, it just seemed too high. This will allow me to make money for my time and effort and seems reasonable. When my husband emailed his co-worker, she jumped right on it and said great - so I guess it's not too much! I'm very excited to make money with my cooking!! |
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craftychick06
True Blue Farmgirl
71 Posts
Darlene
fennville
Mi
USA
71 Posts |
Posted - Jul 27 2006 : 06:18:47 AM
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THANKS everyone for all the good and sound advise!!! I will sell produce for now but will continue to look into a seasonal license which is more suited to what i plan on doing. I cannot believe MICHIGAN EITHER!! we are in such a bad state economywise, it is awful all the companies pullin out and movin away sooooooooooo many jobs have been lost is is nuts!!! I contacted the health dept as i dont think dept of ag was there for me. I talked with a few area farmstands that do similar things and 2 of 4 told me that they buy the jam in plain jars bulk then put their labels on them and sell them that way as a way around the license thing. THAT to me is lying!~~ If someone else made that product NOT using my produce or fruit why on earth would i put my label on it and pass it off as my homemade~~ CRAZY~~~ I cant believe that they told me that too~~ I would be imbarassed to tell someone that!! i guess it sure takes all kinds~~
TY AGAIN EVERYONE~~ i AM KEEPING MY NAME NO MATTER WHO DOES OR DOESNT LIKE IT~~~ lol
**LIVE LIFE JOYFULLY** |
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Lovin Life
True Blue Farmgirl
103 Posts
Lisa
New Hampshire
103 Posts |
Posted - Aug 03 2006 : 4:32:30 PM
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Hi Darlene,
I am in the same boat as you! Really wanting to make a few value added products to sell at our farmer's market, but the dept. of health and food licensing makes it financially "not worth it". I know other people at markets sell their jams and dips and breads all the time and are not using a licensed kitchen, nor do they have a food peddler's permit. Where I am it would cost me about 75.00 just to have someone come out to inspect my kitchen, 10.00 for the application for a license, then you have to have the food peddlers permit which is like 50.00 a year. I asked the food licensing bureau what IS legal to sell without a license. She said dog biscuits, drinks (non alcoholic) soaps, facial products, teas, dry dip mixes. Basically things you don't have to cook, or add dairy products to. I bet you could get away with strawberry spritzers or raspberry lemonade. They sell those things at almost 3.00 a cup at fairs!!
They do make it hard for the little guy who's trying to make a simple honest living dont they??
Good Luck and don't change your farm name I think it's quaint. Oh yeah, here in NH, If you register your farm as a Limited Liability Company with the Secretary of State (100.00 per year), that protects your personal assets in case of a suit. Then you need liability insurance. I did that and did not need a lawyer. Then I called the IRS and got a business ID number for tax purposes.
I'd rather live my life with a "full plate" than an empty one. Life is not a rehearsal... eat up! |
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Entrepreneurship: Food license:> |
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Food license:>
