| Author |
HomeSafeHome:  Canning question  |
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
 Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 1:09:59 PM
|
Hi Farmgirls ~ I've chatted with some of you through my original entry(Mindful Eating) in the Staying in Touch section. I'm trying a different venue, here, because I have a perplexing question I hope some one or another of you have experience with.
I can. A lot. And have for a long time. For the past several years I've loved using my (relatively) new steam canner in the place of the old water-bath - with its weight, bulk and hassle. I've never had trouble - and have pumped out many quarts and pints of canned tomatoes, fruits, sauces --
Then - last year I started have problems with jars breaking. Not in an impressive explosive sort of way, but - just - the bottoms fall right out when I pick up the jars to stow them away!
Which means fruit, tomatoes, you name it -- all over the floor with glass shards.
Yuck.
Many times yuck.
This year - happening again. Not often - maybe one quart out of five in the canner. But -- what might be happening? Any experience out there with this?
I thought it was the new jars I got - and swore off both BiMart and Ball since the sales clerk was so nasty when I tried to return the batch. But - this year it's Kerr and jars I didn't have trouble with last year.
HELP! Any thoughts at all would be most welcome!
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
gramadinah
True Blue Farmgirl
3557 Posts
Diana
Orofino
ID
USA
3557 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 1:49:58 PM
|
Do you have your piece that holds the jars up off from the bottom?
Diana
Farmgirl Sister #273 |
 |
|
|
natesgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
1735 Posts
angela
martinsville
indiana
USA
1735 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 2:09:50 PM
|
Steam canners are notorious for this. They are also not a safe way to can. They have a very uneven heat and nearly twice the cases of botulism related to them as compared to other canners. The uneven heating causes the jars to have some points of higher pressure with other places experiencing lower pressure, then they crack. The uneven heating also allows the middle of the jar to never reach the proper temperature and to harbor germs and bacteria that would have been killed had the temperature been consistant. I just took a class about this very subject.
Farmgirl Sister #1438
God - Gardening - Family - Is anything else important? |
|
|
|
DaisyFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
1646 Posts
Diane
Victoria
BC
Canada
1646 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 2:12:12 PM
|
| I had that problem last year MaryAnn. I wondered if there was a bad batch of glass jars made as I too had never had that problem before. I'd pick up the jar and pop, off would come the bottom! And I know, as I'm sure you do too, that the jars should be hot before going into the canner. Hmm.. |
|
|
|
DaisyFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
1646 Posts
Diane
Victoria
BC
Canada
1646 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 2:14:09 PM
|
| That's great info Angela, and I have to admit I don't know the first thing about "steam" canning. The problem I had was in my pressure canner though. |
|
|
|
Ms.Lilly
True Blue Farmgirl
826 Posts
Lillian
Scotts Mills
OR
USA
826 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 3:44:50 PM
|
Mary Ann- I am with Angela on this one. Steam Canners are not approved for canning. There isn't enough even heat to kill the bacteria that may lie in your food. Please reconsider using this method!
Also a big "hello" from up the road!
Lillian |
|
|
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 4:04:58 PM
|
Wow! This is all so very helpful. THANK YOU! I wondered if it might be too good to be true - the ease compared to the hot water bath. But, sigh, maybe I'll go back to that old tried-n-true method.
Thank you each so much.
(And - also wow - I just noticed you are each living in a place I've been. Born in Indiana, parents lived in Kamiah, ID, and I love, love visiting Victoria. And -- "Hi" to you, Lillian, just up the road. :)
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
|
HealingTouch
True Blue Farmgirl
3448 Posts
Darlene
Kunkletown
Pa
USA
3448 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 6:16:18 PM
|
Hi Mary Ann...I also had the same problem with jars bottoms breaking in my water canner and I thought I might have a bad batch of Ball Jars. Then I had something happen that never happened in all the years I canned. Several wide mouth lids puckered on top. I put them in the fridge and when I went to eat them they were sealed but you could have fooled me.
Glad to hear from you again. Maybe you could do a forum on HFCS and artificial sweeteners and their effects on us or the best weight loss diet or anything else you think we need to know. I'm sure you will get a good response. I check the active topics daily so I'll look for you if you do.
Blessings and Peace,
Darlene
Sister 1922
God first, everything else after!
DNA doesn't make us sisters, Love does!
The road to a friends house is never to long!
|
|
|
|
Cherime
True Blue Farmgirl
1222 Posts
Cherime
Wasilla
Alaska
USA
1222 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 6:28:57 PM
|
How many times have you reused those particular jars. I have had that happen in my pressure cooker to older jars.
CMF |
|
|
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 6:55:35 PM
|
Smiles, Darlene ~ thanks for the suggestions - after the intense phase of the garden produce work-up, I'll likely be putting up more posts. REALLY appreciate the ideas - it's a fave thing to do -- to share.
And - great question, Cherime -- that's the thing. It's only happening to my newer jars. So -- I was sorta getting into the mindset (my husband will attest to this, having heard it SEVERAL times today) - that they "just don't make them like they used to." Jars. Not husbands. Well - that part I don't know about. Good grief. I think I'll stop here.
Grins.
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
|
Sheep Mom 2
True Blue Farmgirl
1534 Posts
Sheri
Elk
WA
USA
1534 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 10:30:36 PM
|
I've been canning for over thirty years and every year I have at least one jar that the bottom falls out in. It's usually in the water bath not in the pressure canner. The age of the jar doesn't seem to matter - it's happened with new ones and old ones alike. It's just part of the process from time to time. Some of my jars are 40 years old and a lot thicker than the newer ones and they do it occasionally too. If anyone knows the cause I'd like to hear it too.
Blessings, Sheri
"Work is Love made visible" -Kahlil Gibran |
|
|
|
Betty J.
True Blue Farmgirl
1404 Posts
Betty
Pasco
WA
USA
1404 Posts |
Posted - Sep 18 2010 : 10:55:33 PM
|
I've had that happen to me too, where the bottom falls out. Messy, Messy, Messy. Yeeech!
You are absolutely right, they don't make the new glass jars like they used to. Just look at the top rim and how thick that is. I have some very old "Mason" jars and I just love them and take care of them like they were diamonds.
Betty in Pasco |
|
|
|
Cherime
True Blue Farmgirl
1222 Posts
Cherime
Wasilla
Alaska
USA
1222 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 07:45:53 AM
|
I just pressure can. Not enough space to do both on the stove. I have not had that happen to the older heavy jars but the thinner ones are the ones that usually go. There are probably flaws in the jars to begin with. I usually hear them go just a tinny chink.
CMF |
|
|
|
star-schipp
True Blue Farmgirl
942 Posts
Starletta
Middletown
Indiana
USA
942 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 07:53:21 AM
|
I'm taking the same class as Angie and another thing the instructor told us was to NOT use a knife to remove the air bubbles from the jar because it can cause teeny tiny nicks in the jar leading to breakage later. Use something not sharp or metal.
We can do no great things; only small things with great love - Mother Teresa
Star - farmgirl sister #1927 |
|
|
|
Sheep Mom 2
True Blue Farmgirl
1534 Posts
Sheri
Elk
WA
USA
1534 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 10:24:43 AM
|
I have always used a chop stick to remove the air bubbles - works well without the risks.
Blessings, Sheri
"Work is Love made visible" -Kahlil Gibran |
|
|
|
natesgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
1735 Posts
angela
martinsville
indiana
USA
1735 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 1:27:18 PM
|
Chopsticks are a great idea! I hadn't thought of that. My bubble wand has went MIA, thank you children, who think everything is for diggin in the yard with. I have a whole box of chopsticks for us to use on oriental nights and they are easy to find around here.
I had forgotten about the metal thing in the jars. You have to keep that in mind when usin the product from the jar as well. I'm gonna go get some long, skinny rubber spatulas for all of my jelly jars. You can damage the bottom of the jar with a butter knife or spoon when diggin for the last of the jelly from the jar!
Farmgirl Sister #1438
God - Gardening - Family - Is anything else important? |
|
|
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 3:25:22 PM
|
These notes continue to be so enlightening and helpful. Yes - the thinner jars are the ones breaking (I was beginning to think, before all this feedback, that was the whole explanation, since I've been canning for over 25 years and had never had this happen before) But -- other recent changes, in addition to switching from hot water to steam canning is that I found a long -- ahem -- metal stick thingee to use to remove air bubbles! Before I have always used a chop stick. (Naively -- I didn't realize I was doing the "right" thing all along!)
So -- thanks some more.
Also -- while I'm on here and getting such good wisdom from the wizened. Another recent malady that's brand new to me is that some of my jars just aren't sealing. Never had that happen before. My suspicion is this -- my mother has passed into her post-canning years after a stroke, and I was bequeathed her supplies. Which included a rather large sack of lids. Lord knows how old some of these are. I check them carefully before using, discarding any that seem questionable in any way -- but -- is there a shelf life for these things? Like I said, I check them carefully - press on the rubber, etc --- but ---
What do you think, Farm Girls? Advice? Could this just be the steamer prob, too?
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
|
Sheep Mom 2
True Blue Farmgirl
1534 Posts
Sheri
Elk
WA
USA
1534 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 4:10:32 PM
|
I have received a lot of "gift" lids - some that have been around for a long time and I do have problems with sealing with the older lids. A lot depends on how and where they were stored. If they were stored in a place that gets hot (like a garage or shed) it can damage the seals. I don't use any lids that I haven't purchased within two years. Older lids will often fail. If the lids are stuck together don't use them as it means the seals have gotten to warm in storage even if they are still pliable. If you are going to store them be sure they are kept in a cool place but don't let them freeze either.
Blessings, Sheri
"Work is Love made visible" -Kahlil Gibran |
|
|
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 19 2010 : 5:02:33 PM
|
Thank you Sheri -- thank you! I think I'll toss the bunch of them. Very helpful!
Your southerly neighbor,
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
|
Betty J.
True Blue Farmgirl
1404 Posts
Betty
Pasco
WA
USA
1404 Posts |
Posted - Sep 20 2010 : 08:23:34 AM
|
Mary Ann, I've found that when pressure canning, filling the jars a little too full have caused the liquid in the jars to pressure out and they are the ones that don't seal because the "juice" has worked its way between the seal and the clean jar rim. I usually use a damp clean cloth to clean the rim before I put the lid on. Hope this makes sense!
Betty in Pasco |
|
|
|
Cherime
True Blue Farmgirl
1222 Posts
Cherime
Wasilla
Alaska
USA
1222 Posts |
Posted - Sep 20 2010 : 08:36:03 AM
|
Just watched If Walls Could Talk on HGTV and they were showing an old home where the metal jar lids had rusted off allowing the animals to get at the stuff inside but the old jars themselves were undamaged. Jars do experience a lot of wear and tear and it is probably best to not be thumping about in them with metal implements.
CMF |
|
|
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - Sep 20 2010 : 10:01:09 AM
|
Yes - it all continues to make sense. I did notice, too, that the jars that didn't seal the most were a batch of pickles in which I tried just a little too hard to squeeze just a little too much more in. I wondered about that.
All of this -- confirming and so helpful. I smile. Who needs Google with Farmgirls around?
:)
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
|
levisgrammy
True Blue Farmgirl
9441 Posts
Denise
Beavercreek
Ohio
USA
9441 Posts |
Posted - Oct 17 2010 : 05:38:41 AM
|
I never heard of using a knife to get the air bubbles out. When I purchased my equipment many years ago I also purchased a long plastic flat utensil for just this purpose. My mom showed me how to can and never mentioned about not using a knife. hmmm. Maybe because she didn't use one. :)
farmgirl sister#43
O, a trouble's a ton or a trouble's an ounce,
Or a trouble is what you make it!
And it isn't the fact that you're hurt that counts,
But only--how did you take it?
--Edmund C. Vance.
|
|
|
|
SunshineDoc
Farmgirl in Training
41 Posts
Mary Ann
Albany
Oregon
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - Oct 17 2010 : 10:55:42 AM
|
I was just thinking about this post yesterday. I have, since this round of good advice done a LOT of canning - using only newish lids; using my old tried'n'true wooden chopstick to remove bubbles, leaving plenty of space in the head, and reverting back to a water bath. All jars sealed. No undue messy incidents.
So - some combination of all these good tips made the difference.
Beautiful!
And now have a pantry full of canned tomotatoes; tomato sauce; tomato pickle; zucchini pickles of a variety of sorts; cherry relish; canned cherries; canned grapes -- etc etc. Lovin' it.
Being mindful is a way of life - and health.
Mary Ann Wallace, MD
www.maryannwallace.com |
|
|
|
emsmommy5
True Blue Farmgirl
1547 Posts
Angie
Buckley
WA
USA
1547 Posts |
Posted - Oct 17 2010 : 11:59:27 AM
|
The time I have had jars break was when getting in a hurry and putting cold pack bottles into a hot canner. If I take the extra few minutes to make sure the bottles are warm, then things seem to do ok. Out of probably 50+ dozen jars this season, I've only lost 3 to breakage and maybe 10 to not sealing.
If I am using older or reusing lids, I boil them for 15 minutes and then recheck for softness of the gasket. I don't reuse lids from pressure canning and don't can with used lids in the pressure canner. And yes, I know some people will have a fit about reusing lids... just have to be careful and inspect well and know when to chuck them in the recylcing. I also reuse those lids to seal jars with the vaccuum packer.
Do what you love, love what you do. |
|
|
|
levisgrammy
True Blue Farmgirl
9441 Posts
Denise
Beavercreek
Ohio
USA
9441 Posts |
Posted - Oct 17 2010 : 12:13:15 PM
|
I have never even given thought to re using my lids.
farmgirl sister#43
O, a trouble's a ton or a trouble's an ounce,
Or a trouble is what you make it!
And it isn't the fact that you're hurt that counts,
But only--how did you take it?
--Edmund C. Vance.
|
|
|
|
HomeSafeHome: Canning question |
|
Canning question
