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Barnyard Buddies:  Thoughts on Animal ID?  |
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brightmeadow
True Blue Farmgirl
2045 Posts
Brenda
Lucas
Ohio
USA
2045 Posts |
 Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 3:04:23 PM
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I recently became aware of the USDA animal ID program. You can read about it here at http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/index.shtml
There was an article in Countryside magazine about this topic, and that article seemed like this program would be detrimental to small farmers. I found another web site about it http://www.stopanimalid.org. You can probably tell from their name what their position is.
I'm not sure what I think about this program yet. I know it is important to keep good records of your livestock for production reasons, but I'm not too sure about sharing those records with the public. Does anyone have any actual experience with registering their stock with the USDA?
You shall eat the fruit of the labor of your hands - You shall be happy and it shall be well with you. -Psalm 128.2
Visit my web site store at http://www.watkinsonline.com/fish or my homepage at http://home.earthlink.net/~brightmeadow |
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happymama58
True Blue Farmgirl
1210 Posts
Patti
Missouri
USA
1210 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 3:20:24 PM
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I don't have any farm animals yet, of course, but I've been reading up on this. I am *not* in favor of a national animal ID program at all. The reasons that are given to justify the practice sound very weak (at best) to me.
I'm not anti-government or anything like that at all, but this just smacks me as wrong.
Some people search for happiness; others create it. |
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Aunt Jenny
True Blue Farmgirl
11381 Posts
Jenny
middle of
Utah
USA
11381 Posts |
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LadyCrystal
True Blue Farmgirl
593 Posts
Alicia
Rhode Island
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 3:50:17 PM
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I am against it.It would mean that for every poultry show we go to we would have to send in paper work for each bird and where is has been and back.We transport 20 to 30 birds per show.What a pain in the tush.
Alicia
http://fromcitytocountrygirl.blogspot.com/
follow your dreams |
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brightmeadow
True Blue Farmgirl
2045 Posts
Brenda
Lucas
Ohio
USA
2045 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 4:07:25 PM
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Well so far it is voluntary but I wonder if they plan to make it compulsory when they get enough people signed up. Somewhere I read that big producers wouldn't have to tag or tatoo (or whatever) every single animal because it would be assumed they kept good enough records but that the smaller producers would have to mark every animal. That is one thing that bothers me, since we all pay taxes! It would hurt the little guy disproportionately.
You shall eat the fruit of the labor of your hands - You shall be happy and it shall be well with you. -Psalm 128.2
Visit my web site store at http://www.watkinsonline.com/fish or my homepage at http://home.earthlink.net/~brightmeadow |
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Luzy
True Blue Farmgirl
922 Posts
Luanne
Pueblo
Colorado
USA
922 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2006 : 6:41:44 PM
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I don't like it one bit! Really scares me. I heard that there is a test area going on and before you can buy feed at the local feed store, you have to give them your info on your animals. This is how the Gov. finds out what type of livestock you have. I don't know if this is true, just what I've heard. I think the whole thing stinks! Luzy
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May I always be the kind of person my dog thinks I am. |
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AnnieT
True Blue Farmgirl
287 Posts
Annie
287 Posts |
Posted - Feb 20 2006 : 10:05:56 AM
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Please everyone write or call your congressman to stop this. There is no reason big brother needs to know how many lambs you had born this year. If this goes thru your vet will be required to report you if you havent registered your animals. Imagine yor doctor reporting you if you dont have a drivers license, or if your child doesn't have a social security number. Rediculous!
Bramblestitches Store: www.bramblestitches.etsy.com
My blog: http://bramblestitches.blogspot.com/ |
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MullersLaneFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
596 Posts
Rock Falls
IL
596 Posts |
Posted - Feb 20 2006 : 12:15:26 PM
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www.nonaisorg is another good informational site.
We will be hosting the IL rep of the USDA next month. Hope to have some state legis. reps on hand too. From talking to the USDA rep on the phone, they "haven't thought of how this would affect the small livestock holder" .... yeah right!
Cyndi
Joshua 24:15
Ol 'MacDonald has nothing on us!
http://www.mullerslanefarm.com |
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ThymeForEweFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
705 Posts
Robin
An organic farm in the forest in
Maine
USA
705 Posts |
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Annab
True Blue Farmgirl
2900 Posts
Anna
Seagrove
NC
USA
2900 Posts |
Posted - Feb 22 2006 : 03:39:58 AM
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A similar article is also in the newest addition of Backyard Poultry. Feb/March 2006 p. 44
I think we are already ultra regulated. |
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ThymeForEweFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
705 Posts
Robin
An organic farm in the forest in
Maine
USA
705 Posts |
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brightmeadow
True Blue Farmgirl
2045 Posts
Brenda
Lucas
Ohio
USA
2045 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2006 : 04:49:29 AM
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Some joker wrote a letter to the editor of our local paper complaining about 'farm subsidies' contributing to the high cost of food.
I wrote a letter back asking him to prove it - I could just as easily accuse big agribusiness corporations of taking "corporate welfare" payments from the government - and then I asked him to look at how the USDA is spending his tax dollar on programss like animal ID.
It will be interesting to see if they publish my reply... if they do I will post a link to it.
You shall eat the fruit of the labor of your hands - You shall be happy and it shall be well with you. -Psalm 128.2
Visit my web site store at http://www.watkinsonline.com/fish or my homepage at http://home.earthlink.net/~brightmeadow |
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ThymeForEweFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
705 Posts
Robin
An organic farm in the forest in
Maine
USA
705 Posts |
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greyghost
True Blue Farmgirl
650 Posts
Lynn
Summerville
Georgia
USA
650 Posts |
Posted - Feb 23 2006 : 12:46:38 PM
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| just wait - pretty soon, they'll be putting tags on us. |
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MullersLaneFarm
True Blue Farmgirl
596 Posts
Rock Falls
IL
596 Posts |
Posted - Feb 24 2006 : 08:56:14 AM
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Lynn,
They already do chip alzheimer patients. It will only be a matter of time when our children/grandchildren are chipped 'for their own protection.
I'll take a homestead at the end of a long dirt road as my form of protection any day
Cyndi
Joshua 24:15
Ol 'MacDonald has nothing on us!
http://www.mullerslanefarm.com |
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therusticcottage
True Blue Farmgirl
4439 Posts
Kay
Vancouver
WA
USA
4439 Posts |
Posted - Feb 24 2006 : 09:52:32 AM
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There is no way that I will let any of my children/grandchildren be chipped. I agree with Cyndi -- I would move so far back in the woods no one would be able to find me.
Mine is just a little old fashioned garden where the flowers come together to praise the Lord, and teach all who look upon them to do likewise.
-- Celia Thaxter
http://therusticcottage.etsy.com
http://rusticcottage.blogspot.com/ |
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greyghost
True Blue Farmgirl
650 Posts
Lynn
Summerville
Georgia
USA
650 Posts |
Posted - Feb 24 2006 : 10:24:21 AM
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I say we move in with the Amish. :)
I mean, really, think of all the things we could learn hands-on from them? And does the gov't ever really bug them? |
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therusticcottage
True Blue Farmgirl
4439 Posts
Kay
Vancouver
WA
USA
4439 Posts |
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Horseyrider
True Blue Farmgirl
1045 Posts
Mary Ann
Illinois
1045 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2006 : 04:56:29 AM
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I'm fairly neutral on it, but there are a lot of good things that could come of it.
Let's assume that there's an act of bioterrorism. Poisoning our food supply could be very disruptive. If we know where all the infected animals from Farm A were shipped, then we don't necessarily need to quarantine or euthanize the critters on Farm B and Farm C. Believe me, nobody wants to take down any more animals than they have to; disposal is a huge issue.
Or there can be a natural outbreak of a disease. Where did they go? Who did they have contact with? (A given steer can be on and off of several feedlots before slaughter.) What were they in contact with? Hoof in mouth is deadly to split footed animals, but we're immune to it. We can carry it on our shoes from farm to farm, spreading it. With chipping, only the sick animals and exposed animals need to be put down. And we can actually eat this meat with no ill effects; we are immune. The more history we have, the more likely we can minimize losses.
A lot of people made these same noises when the government first decided to require yearly Coggins testing for all horses. The Coggins test reveals the presence of EIA, Equine Infectious Anemia. There is no cure, and it can spread like crazy. But folks have easily adapted. My vet sets aside six days in the spring to go from farm to farm drawing blood and taking pictures of stock, and doesn't even charge a farm call. We've adapted. Also, horses moving across state lines have to have a thirty day health certificate. That was seen as an impossible headache at first, too; but we've adapted. Most vets simply give the certificate to regular clients whose health practices they know. And it's a quick check to make the certificate. If you're showing or selling, you'll have a lot of them. It's a PITA, but it limits the travel or dumping of sick animals.
It would be easy to add a microchip in the spring to herds that haven't been chipped. It's a proof of ownership that's difficult to tamper with; fewer animals could be stolen and end up in slaughter houses, and unscrupulous farmers wouldn't be allowed to ship and dump sick stock. When you run herds through the chute for vaccination or worming, chipping could be added. So many cows lose ear tags, and when you lose ear tags you lose history; this could be a permanent identification.
And as far as your kids go, these same Big Brother arguments were made when social security numbers came into being. I don't see anyone turning away their social security benefits.
I'm not looking to ruffle anyone's feathers, but it's natural for me to want to look at both sides of an issue. Most of the time, there are pretty compelling reasons on both sides.
"What another would do as well as you, do not do it. What another would have said as well as you, do not say it; written as well, do not write it. Be faithful to that which exists nowhere but in yourself, and there, make yourself indispensable." ---Andre Gide |
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Mari-dahlia
True Blue Farmgirl
269 Posts
Marianne
Hoosick Falls
New York
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2006 : 07:04:02 AM
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Mary Ann,
I have to agree with you. I know all of the farmers up here are against it and the organic people are against it. Most of the people when asked why they are against , are against the bill for fear reasons. They do not trust the Government and the USDA and I understand why. There are almost as many USDA inspector jokes as there are POlish jokes and there is good reason.
Most farmers already know where their stock is from and where it is going and what it has come in contact with. IN the case of birds and chickens it is also vital. If a chicken comes down with the lethal strain of Bird Flu you need to be able to track it to affectively put an early stop to the spread.
Mad cow scares me the most. Clorine and all other sterilizers are not effective against the strain.
The Government control does have me concerned. |
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therusticcottage
True Blue Farmgirl
4439 Posts
Kay
Vancouver
WA
USA
4439 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2006 : 08:15:57 AM
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I think one reason a lot of people are against it is the expense. Small family farms have enough trouble keeping their heads above water. Now the USDA comes along and says you have to pay to have a chip implanted and pay a yearly fee. How much are you going to get charged for the chip implant? I'm sure there's some chip company that is cozy with the gov't that is just waiting to make bucks on this one. There are other ways that could probably be implemented to track the animals besides micro-chips and satellites. I don't think people have a problem registering their animals -- that makes sense because of all the diseases we're dealing with now. But what they have a problem with is the feeling that the they are going to be watched -- that is an invasion of privacy and very creepy.
Mine is just a little old fashioned garden where the flowers come together to praise the Lord, and teach all who look upon them to do likewise.
-- Celia Thaxter
http://therusticcottage.etsy.com
http://rusticcottage.blogspot.com/ |
Edited by - therusticcottage on Feb 25 2006 12:36:29 PM |
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jmac1711
Farmgirl in Training
49 Posts
Jane
Lost Nation
Iowa
USA
49 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2006 : 12:05:35 PM
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Wow, I was glad to see that you Gals have been talking about this issue. I am from Iowa and I first came across these changes in 2005 when it became required that I test all my poultry for Pullorum/Typhoid. It is now required testing on all poultry over 4 months of age. As part of a state certification program I attended a presentation was done on Biosecurity. They detailed the now volunteer animal id registration program and the individual farm id registration program and did say that eventually they would become manditory. I am a pretty progressive farmer and believe in doing all that is reasonable to ensure healthy practices. (after all that's why I was there) For the most part other attendees were techs from large corporate farms and a few from poultry labs that do testing for farms. Anyway, during the presentation reference was made to several specific disease outbreaks the state/county has experienced over the years. These outbreaks were said to be caused by the small "backyard farmer". They went on to characterize small farmer's as a group who are resistant to all change, uneducated in current farm practices and without the integrity to report community health issues (I'm paraphrasing a bit there) I had a discussion with an assistance state vet. from the program afterward about my concerns. He said the state is following a national model and that any discussion about how the programs affect family farms could only happen on that level. This was a bit discouraging as the people representing us are the Poulty Board (all owners of large hatcheries and commercial poultry farms)So as it stands we will be dragged along with the new regulations hanging by our teeth and dropped by the weighside if you can't keep up.
Lord, let me be the kind of person my pig thinks I am. |
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therusticcottage
True Blue Farmgirl
4439 Posts
Kay
Vancouver
WA
USA
4439 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2006 : 12:35:51 PM
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Jane -- I think if I had attended that meeting as a small backyard farmer I would have been totally insulted. From my observation I would feel that most small farmers are able to know their animals much better than any large corporation could. We are "up close and personal" with our animals daily and notice anything out of the ordinary. The small farmers that I know are very educated about current farm practices and to say that they lack integrity to report health issues is so wrong. Of course the large corporate farms, who have managed to kill off most family farms, are going to make these claims. These statements should make the small farmer more determined than ever to prove them wrong.
Mine is just a little old fashioned garden where the flowers come together to praise the Lord, and teach all who look upon them to do likewise.
-- Celia Thaxter
http://therusticcottage.etsy.com
http://rusticcottage.blogspot.com/ |
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jmac1711
Farmgirl in Training
49 Posts
Jane
Lost Nation
Iowa
USA
49 Posts |
Posted - Feb 25 2006 : 2:09:52 PM
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Yes Kay, it was an insult to be sure and I agree with you that we keep much closer eyes on our animals. I came away from the meeting with exactly the idea of being the postergirl for good small farming practices and the feeling that I didn't want to give anyone a reason to question my practices or commitment to a healthy farm community. I felt more extreme intimidation than anything. I do agree that biosecurity on farms is very important and we have developed a plan for our farm based on the national model. We are also ID'ing our group hatches of poultry and following the model for record keeping. In the event that we were to have a disease outbreak I would have no problem turning over our records imediately. But since none of our animals leave the farm (with the exception of dogs and cats and guinea pigs to the vet and PetSmart) I have a real problem with being monitored by government. The idea that my farm must have a premises ID is bothersome to me too. The practices of large corporate farming are completely contrary to small scale and organic farming, in my mind. I can see the day of free range practices being labled unacceptable because of the risk to biosecurity under these laws and that would surely be a shame. We also have not yet ID chip our pig. She is strictly a pet but I can see us getting a dog ID chip from the vet and registering her on a pet database in the event that she would ever wonder off the farm. (Which has never happened) I guess I wish the new laws would have more room for diversity in farming and make a place for the small farmer.
Lord, let me be the kind of person my pig thinks I am. |
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Ginastjoe
Farmgirl at Heart
7 Posts
Gina
St Joe
IN
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 26 2006 : 5:44:55 PM
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This is a scary thing. The feds used statewide programs (lured state reps with big $$ grants to implement their own programs) because it is unconstitutional on a federal level. When you visit the USDA website check your individual state's version of the program. Indiana, my state, plans to set their "voluntary" program in motion Sept. 2006. I place volunatary in quotes because the voluntary part is that if you don't sell, buy, or transport livestock you don't have to register, although it is recommended.
I have been fighting this since I learned about it in November and have not received response from any of my state's reps or had my letters-to-the-editors published. It's frustrating how quiet everyone is on this issue. Additionally, I am finding few people are even aware of it, including my local feedstore.
I live in an area that also includes a large Amish population. Much of NAIS is going to be done via computer (e.g. registering, filing paperwork for transport or death, changing records, etc.) I do not believe they have addressed their concerns either. I spoke to one Amish couple at a small farming conference recently and he said, "Some of us will have to take a stand perhaps even die for it." This may be a drastic viewpoint, but when you consider how this will affect some people's way of life, it's completely understanable.
Please write letters!
Here are a few more helpful links:
www.homeschoolblogger.com/sdbookmom/
Someone's reallife experience in one of the "test" states
www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/369063795
A petition against NAIS
www.stopanimalid.org
Someone probably listed this one, but just in case...
On a related note, there was an Associated Press article about another proposal from the Dept. of Ag about how they want to allow the export of slaughtered poultry to CHina for processing and re-import back into the US. It makes their argument that this will protect us from viruses quite weak when you consider that what they are proposing could quite literally "spoon feed" us viruses that could affect our livestock. I think you can read the article at www.nonais.org
Thanks for mentioning this!!!
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Ginastjoe
Farmgirl at Heart
7 Posts
Gina
St Joe
IN
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - Feb 26 2006 : 5:57:11 PM
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Oh, I forgot to mention also that one effrective alternative (to address disease concerns) is too test animals slated for slaughter. One, it already exists, and two, it would not affect those of us who are in it merely as hobby or home farmers.
Kay, you mentioned something about the chip companies being in with the govn. You hit it on the head: NAIS was created & supported by the big guys in agri-business and the one of the micro-chip companies. My information is not exact here, but check out some of th elinks for more accurate info.
In my opinion, the issue is not the protection of our food supply (knowing your farmer or growing your own is the best security measure you can make), but that govn is mandating yet another bureacracy nightmare on us without considering all who are concerned.
Ok,sorry for putting in way more than 2 cents :-) |
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Barnyard Buddies: Thoughts on Animal ID? |
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Thoughts on Animal ID?
