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Barnyard Buddies:  All Things Sheep and Goats  |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
 Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 07:27:08 AM
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We have been having a very interesting sharing at the Stitching forum that started with my Tail Spun Yarn and has moved into all sorts of adventures into breeding, selection of genetics, fleece information and we felt that to continue the sharing it might be served more if we moved over here....
To catch up you can read "Tail Spun Anyone"? in the Stitching Forum. Please feel free to ask questions and to answer questions - we have all types of fiber animals represented here and it would be wonderful to get to know them better. I have or have had Alpaca, Llamas, Angorga and Cashmere Goats, Icelandic, Southdown, Corriedale Sheep, French Angora Rabbits, and Great Pry's (Yes, I spin dog) and have in my studio everything from plants to Yak so let get busy and talk....
PLEASE
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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kristin sherrill
True Blue Farmgirl
11303 Posts
kristin
chickamauga
ga
USA
11303 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 07:37:17 AM
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This sounds like a great thing to talk about. I do love goats and sheep.
I just recently sold my last 2 sheep. I would love to get a few sheep with good wool. So need to learn more about the wool breeds. I inherited my great grandmother's spinning wheel a few years ago and would love to start spinning soon. So any info would be great.
Maybe some classes or get togethers with close farmgirls, too????
It sure makes learning so much more fun with friends, right?
So now I'm looking forward to actually learning to do something with this wheel besides looking at it and dreaming.
Kris |
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 08:14:03 AM
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If it's about sheep, I'm in. I did not keep up with the tailspun post after page 6 or so but just re-read it...so probably good you did move this, Grace. Good description on the cellophane crackling sound for fleece with "break" in it.
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 09:09:04 AM
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Kris - great to have you - I have sold all my sheep too but what I have put in place are contracts on some of them to receive back the fleeces. I also did the same of some of my alpacas too - what I have offered is assistance in the new folks fiber business, animal management and then also in teaching them fiber related personal classes.
Love your idea of classes offered by farmgirls. That is what I have done for years getting folks to interesting in keeping these incredible animals heritage alive and thriving.
Hi Jami, Great to see you hear - thanks about the crackling - it sure saves folks time and money on their fleeces and also assists in their management of their animals. I would love to hear some of your tricks for your animals.
What was the biggest lesson you learned in keeping sheep??? (or goats)
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 1:05:06 PM
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I have learned lots of lessons in raising sheep. Here's what I would tell myself if I had asked that question Grace asked. My best suggestion is to find a good mentor...and buy some good books too. Join your local sheep producers group to make some sheep friends.
Don't run out and buy everything that the sheep catalog has--get a few minor essentials for lambing and adapt as you go. Like my lamb warming box---it's a real cardboard box that I throw away after lambing is over, not an expensive wooden box that has plans and an equipment list to purchase, has to be built and stored after use. I usually find an apple box (cardboard) lid and cut a circlar hole in one end to fit my hairdryer (yes, my personal one in my bathroom  ) nozzle into...place the lamb in the box with another hole cut to stick its head out so it doesn't get overheated at the other end of the box or the side of it close to the floor so it can lay its head down flat (put a towel under it for a pillow). Cover the top with a towel or blanket so I can check often on it and those chilled lambs warm up quick. I do this in the house so I can warm up too. When they are perked up and ready for a meal, they pop up out of their hole and stand up and usually knock the box over and I know they are ready to have a feeding and go back outside to their mother. If I have more than one lamb in the box, I cut more holes for heads to stick out, like a set of triplets or something. If they piddle in it (they always do) I just throw it out and get another one. One box usually lasts through a lambing season. Don't usually have to warm up too many.
I've learned when to give a newborn lamb an enema...at first I thought the book was hooey and then I tried it and it worked like a charm to evacuate the meconium and get the lamb warmed up. Stuff like that I have learned that the average person just wouldn't know what to do but reading and researching can be a wonderful thing in raising sheep. I've learned to read Laura Lawson's book Managing Your Ewe and her Newborn Lambs. It's not a book you just sit and read but rather look up the problem you're having and it has a set of charts to lead you to possible causes and solutions. It's the best book I've used for lambing time. There have been many a night with me bringing in a lamb and my husband grabbing that book so we can treat a lamb.
Grace, your contracts sound interesting on the fleeces. Now that's the way to do it! No feeding or lambing but lots of fleece.
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 1:51:53 PM
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Great idea with the warming box - I too have never made that wooden box. I have a hairdryer in the barn and a laundry basket with towels at hand. As long as everything looks O.K. I let Mom do the work, if there is a question then I take a couple of towels, wipe the baby down, heat it up with the hair dryer, when it stands and cries it is back to mom. Since at that time I do not touch the baby with my hands but rather towels there is no transfere of smells. If the little one is not doing well it is off to the house, into the sink with very warm water, rubbed down, navel dipped while dryer it off, heating up with hairdryer, and then a band aid over the anas. That way I know what comes out - this is a great trick for Llamas and Alpacas because it is vital that you know their meconium has passed. I only do that for those I am concerned about. I also give in their first two bottles Pedialite - has great things in it and will not effect them at all. If they end up being in the house for long then for the first week that is what I mix their milk with. Keeps them from getting the runs which can be the death of a little one. I too love,love, love those books and that is the first books I tell folks to purchase if they are going to have sheep. Here is a trick I learned from a sheperdess of about four generations. In you barn kit always have packets of sugar. That's right. If you have a ewe who prolapses, rinse off the uterus with cold water and pour a packet of sugar on it. This is done with clean hands. Then push back the uterus cover with gauze and here is the other trick. Take a cotton tee shirt cut the front down the middle but leave the back alone. Put each back leg in an arm hole. Pull up the shirt over the rump and either tie it together on the back our secure with baby diaper pins. Do not use regular pins because they could pop open. Diaper pins will not. This will leave the teats available for baby and you can change and wash the shirt over and over. I have used this method twice with wonderful sucess..
I also purchase toddler sweat shirts at thrift stores to use on child animals. Again you can use the diaper pins to take up the extra fabric - also everything is washable. I also purchase towels from dollar stores, garage sales and such for birthing season.
This is Fun - and your right - I get the best of my animals while assisting new owners...
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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kristin sherrill
True Blue Farmgirl
11303 Posts
kristin
chickamauga
ga
USA
11303 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 4:59:36 PM
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Do ya'll give the mothers molasses water after they lamb? I always give my goats a big bucket of it warm. I also did my ewes, too. It's supposed to help the milk come down and gives them lots of good stuff they need to recover from birthing.
This sis going to be a grest way to learn so much more.
Oh, I never wanted my goats or sheep to lamb or kid till it got a little warmer. I always plan for April or May babies. Is that a bad thing or am I just lazy and don't want to be out in the cold?
I am getting my buck back tomorrow to start breeding my does. I know it's a little later than I normally do it, but I've been out of town til now. Let the fun begin!!!
Kris |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 07 2008 : 6:08:19 PM
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Your not lazy - I would love it if my girls would want to wait - they seem to cycle this way - also when I sold for shows and 4 H the animals had to be of a certain age to qualify. I did an experiment 4 years ago and held half of my goats back and tried to breed them later - well they would have nothing to do with that plan. I even had one girl who gave birth twice in one year, just to spit me..
Your right about the molasses it given them a sugar rush like when we eat a candy bar. There is a great herbal supplement you can give from Farmstead that will give them more milk and better health. I also give my animals after birthing Rescue Remedy and I even get a couple of drops. Great for the nerves..
Sounds like love will be in the air at your farm this weekend. All the lip smacking, snorting, bellowing and such. With nine billies here it can be deafing..
Here is another question - How did you pick the animals you have??
When I started in sheep I purchased the Grand Champion flock of Southdowns that won the National Western Stock Show along with the Grand Champion Ram. I then purchased the another two ewes from a local breeder who had continually won Champion placements for the last six years - that was back in 1997. That year I also researched and purchased 30 Icelandic sheep from the top three and orginal breeders of Icelandic's. That coming year we had nearly 75 sheep. So as you can see I love a challenge and alot of work.
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2008 : 12:20:42 PM
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Certainly no one can call you a slacker, Grace. You're amazing!
Kris, we too give our ewes warm molasses water right after lambing too along with a flake of grass hay. I use Nutridrench for another boost if a ewe is either older (and tuckered out after lambing) or if we had to assist in getting lambs out. Last year we bred our ewe lambs too early (young) and we had to pull every darned lamb out of those youngsters (14 of them). Oh my word, never again. Live and learn. This year the ewe lambs are not getting bred until January and we'll raise those lambs to be locker lambs as they won't make feeder size for the commercial buyers in time for their last pick-up date next fall.
That is why we lamb early, Kris, to hit our best markets in time. By that, I mean Superior Packing sends up a truck once a month from July through October. If we don't have their minimum size (75 lbs) by October, we're out of luck and have to direct market the lambs which we do anyhow but I don't like doing too many of those. It sure is nice lambing when it's warmer though...heavenly in fact. We don't even check during the night when we lamb in May or June. We have real severely windy cold springs here and every year I curse more about the wind than anything because we have to be so vigilant about checking the ewes often...and you know how it is....you don't have anyone lamb all day long and it's time for bed and then a ewe starts going into labor. Never fails.
Grace, real interesting on the sugar and t-shirt trick. I have only had one ewe prolapse on me when I first got sheep. I had no idea what it was! She had quads and I went out and they were laying all over the field dead. Then she spent her time trying to steal a single lamb from another ewe. That was my first year in sheep and I had Suffolks then--not a breed I enjoyed raising and I sold that small flock of 14. With my Texels, haven't had a uterine prolapse since but this summer had a ewe with a rectal prolapse...culled her.
I know a gal in Montana who is in the Icelandic world who just bought a Texel ram and 3 ewes from me. She is very proud of her sheep and is an active AI breeder, bringing in semen from Iceland, etc. Pretty interesting stuff. Nice gal too.
More later on why I chose the breeds I have now...until then I'll enjoy reading up on what you gals have to say. This is fun. I love to talk sheep.
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2008 : 12:35:21 PM
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Grace, by the way, if I had a barn I would have everything out there to treat cold lambs like you. We have a shed but it only has an extension cord for a light and nowhere to sit stuff or store it like equipment needed--it's all full of jugs. So I have a lambing kit with all of the essentials in a plastic tote that I haul back and forth from the house during lambing. That way I can wash everything up in between lambs too. Also keep a pile of clean towels (I have towels purchased cheap just for lambing) by the front door and always have a load going in the washer. I have even "gasp" used a heat lamp at times out there when it's an extreme night and lambs get cold. This year I am going to do something I've never done before and I'm making lamb coats out of polarfleece to put on the lambs right after birth. I have a new sheep friend who did this last year and the ewes didn't care and the lambs did great in the cold weather. She only left them on for a few days...like I said, I like to learn new things and try them out..at least once!
DH is talking "barn"...my heart is going pitter-patter but I'm not going to hold my breath just yet.
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2008 : 6:59:05 PM
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Jami, we all do what we have to - I know that anyone who has animals work their tails off. I only had to do the prolapse trick years ago and that was with a friends Suffolk sheep - I was watching her farm and her dates where all off on when they where to deliver - I had her fourteen Suffolk Sheep and 10 prolapsed. I sure got practice at that - luckly none ever on my farm. My son and I did have to do a C-section of an Icelandic sheep our first year with the breed. She had triplets and one got stuck and I could not get it clear and she was going down hill so we got out the vet books and the big lights and went at it. Buy the time the vet arrived all he had to do was sew her up. He sad she would never have lambs again - well with proper selection of rams she had a health single every year for six years until she was struck by lighting - another long story.
Today I just finished the kidding barn - All cleaned down,panels ready for kidding jugs, lights tested, buckets, pails, and kits cleaned and ready to go. The new hay comes in Tuesday. There is not an inch of me that does not hurt but everything is ready for winter, kids and a great time in the barn....
Here is my next question - how do you deal with prediators? I have three Great Pry's, Llamas who are really great at killing coyotoes(not sure I spelled that right) flood lights on all barn openings and little sleep by doing night watches. What has been your experiences??
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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kristin sherrill
True Blue Farmgirl
11303 Posts
kristin
chickamauga
ga
USA
11303 Posts |
Posted - Nov 08 2008 : 7:19:45 PM
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Back to choosing breeds. I would like to know more about the Icelandic sheep. Are they easy keepers? I do know a lady here in Chick. that raises them. They are so expensive, though. And is the wool really good? They are a multi-purpose breed, too, right? We have some Mexican(?) families who come by here a few times a year to buy my ewes for BBQ's and I know I can sell the meat breed sheep and lambs fast. Also the Marino sheep. I guess I could look up breeds on line, but if anyone has these, and can tell me more, that would be great.
Also you had asked how we chose the animals we had. I knew I wanted milk goats and a friend had Nubians. I do not like them at all. They are way too noisy for me. The Lamancha's are the ones I chose. They are beautiful, after you get past the no ears thing. And so much quieter. They fit my personality great. I do have a half Nubian and Togg. that I got as a 2 day old. She's only noisy if she's been left in the stanchion too long. Or by herself! Oberhasli and Saanen are all alike to me. I could not tell them apart. So I love my Lamancha's a lot.
As far as sheep, I've had Suffolk, and St. Criox.
I only have 2 Rat Terriers and a Yellow Lab for "gaurd dogs". Never have needed any, really. There are coyotes all around here, but never have had a problem with them. And I do not like llamas at all. They just scare me. And so do donkeys.
Kris |
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LunaTheFarmLady
True Blue Farmgirl
448 Posts
Luna
Rineyville
KY
USA
448 Posts |
Posted - Nov 09 2008 : 5:34:04 PM
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Hi Ladies
Thanks Grace for starting this discussion over here. Already got a lot new informatin and like Jami, I love talking sheep and fiber. I have Shetlands as you probably all know by now. Why them? I did a lot of research on many breeds before choosing them. I wanted wool sheep first of all. And i wanted a variety of colors. I wanted sheep that were easy to handle and trainable and that also had multiple births and known to be good mothers. Shetlands fit this all perfectly. They are just the best for me. That being said....I've never had any others! I've gone through my first full cycle with breeding and birthing with minimal problems. While my flock is very small compared to Jami's and Grace's i think they have given me a basic education on sheep raising. I am ready for the next level and want to know more about breeding for color within a breed. Oh I forgot one criteria was that we wanted a heritage or primitive breed that we wanted to work with. Our sheep come from a very reputable breeder who has had many champions in her flock and was able to guide us through the first year on what to expect and has always been ready to answer any questions for us. That has been invaluable and i would agree that it is important to have that kind of mentorship when starting out. I would love to have someone closer but, as I found out, there are not too many wool sheep breeders of any kind in my area of KY. Lots of meant sheep, mostly Khadadin and Dorsets and Hampshires. None of which appeal to me. I haven't been into the meat side of the industry but I'm giving it some thought as a way to earn more from the farm. However, I'm not fond of the idea of going through the emotional involvement of birthing and caring for sheep and then sending off to slaughter. I know I'm too romantic about the whole thing. That is why I now have 6 ram lambs that are beautiful but that require a separate fenced area from my litte flock. That makes my life just that little bit more complicated. They need to be sold for breeding (they are all of excellent stock and beautiful conformation).
Anyway, my original question to Grace was about those 30 Icelandics that she bought. This sounds, to me, like an enormous undertaking not only in management but in investment. I would like to know more about her process for picking them. You mentioned that you had examples of all the known colors in that original flock. How many were rams out the first group? How did you segregate the different rams and how did you control who bred with who. I guess there had to be a lot of different fenced off aresas and a way to move them from one to anogher.
A big issue for me is financing a larger opertions. There is the cost of fencing and shelter (our pastures have very little in the way of shade in the summer and we have huge cold winds in the winter. This translates to me into investing in structures in additon to the diferent fenced areas. What kind of fencing to you use? or do you?
As far as predateor, knock on wood and praise the powers, this has not been an issue for me. I have my 5 foot 4 inch wire fences and that's it. Nothing has ever gotten in nor have I ever seen evidence of attempts. I know the coyotes are out there. I hear them every night in the nearby hills and wooded areas. But I've never seen them near my sheep.
Luna The Farm Lady
http://blueballmountainspindleneedleworks.blogspot.com/
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 09 2008 : 10:14:28 PM
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Well I am back in the house and ready to talk sheep..
To answer the questions about Icelandic and why I picked them - I too want a very controled limited niche market. I had Southdowns who give the best meat around, easy to take care of and wonderful animals. I had llamas with their long fleece and alpacas with their shorter denser fleece. A Icelandic sheep has the dual coat so I could separte the fleece and use them to blend with my camels and not change the finer qualities of the fibers. You bet I did homework like crazy. When I started there was 23 breeders of Icelandic in the US so I have a corner spot. I took the top three breeders - one was the lady who brought them to Canada and then the US. The other two where the first breeders here in the US so I was deal with real great stock and knowledge. I spent months pouring over pedigrees and such and made my final selections. I made sure I had no related stock, all the colors represented including those recessive ones, and I selected four rams. I also dealt with temperment and socialization when grouping them here at the farm. Trust me tons of fences I put in (7 pastures with barns and sheds in each pasture), it was a very expensive operation but this was our sole business and income. Now I must tell you when all of them arrived within 5 days we were hit with the worst blizzard every and I stood in horror thinking my whole group of Icelandics where dead in my pastures because in the white out conditions for four days we could not find them under the 6 feet of snow. Finally as I sat crying for the third day my oldest said "Mom they came from Iceland - they will be find". I said prayers all day long and night but knew I was ruined. On the fifth day as we crawled on our bellies bring hay to the animals in the barns, my oldest son fell thru the snow drifts and what did he find - there was all the Icelandics eating away - they found a pocket as the snow started to gather and somehow managed to survive - we dug and dug until we cleared a path for them to the barn - God watched over this fool. Every since then I always tell folks that week made me truely believe in those sheep. Anyway back to how I marketed them, yes they are incredible meat production, they are now used in sheep milking/cheese operations and they produce fantastic dual fiber. All that being said you really need to do your research to do your business correctly.
Once you have the sheep you will be a record keeping hound. Each season I selected who went with who and they where moved like a square dance on the farm. Pastures where for breeding and then I took all the girls back into the big barn for lambing season. Records are the life blood of this kind of operation. Culling is too.. By having all of them unrelated then the second generation gave your pool of rams to grow without looking outside your farm. Also I required all my rams to be able to get along because once breeding was over they all went back into one pasture. I do this with my billies too. It is why I said soliations and management is key. If I had someone who was out of control he left the farm... I do not breed bad temperments. Also keeping llamas in with the boys helps them stay calm and the llamas would step in if someone got out of line.
I know this is lengthy but there is no one answer to selection of a breed, an animal or a business - we all have had our share of wrong turns but hopefully we learn from them and share that info with others on their search. Hope that helped alittle. 
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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LunaTheFarmLady
True Blue Farmgirl
448 Posts
Luna
Rineyville
KY
USA
448 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 03:13:03 AM
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Hi Grace
Thanks for the insight into your operation. I am on my way out the door again and just wanted to stop in and check. I will write more and ask more this evening. I'm at a very beginning phase here but I think so far so good. I know that my next decisions are crucial. And thankfully, so far, God has been watching over this fool too although, I must say that there has been no challenge to test me yet to the proportion of that blizzard! My blizzard seems to be this dragged out battle with my ex that tears me away from where I need to be. However, I am dug in and not leaving here! I'll catch you all a little later!
Luna The Farm Lady
http://blueballmountainspindleneedleworks.blogspot.com/
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kristin sherrill
True Blue Farmgirl
11303 Posts
kristin
chickamauga
ga
USA
11303 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 04:44:57 AM
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Thanks for the great info, Grace. I do think I like the Icelandic. I need to go see them again. It's good that they are so close. I'd have her for a mentor! A very good thing to have.
But I know nothing about genetics and all that. When ya'll start talking about that, it just goes way over my head! I am not a scientific person at all. But I guess if I had to I would learn. I hear about all the genetics in cattle now and I'm amazed. How do they do it? I guess it's just the best of the best, basically.
Anyway, I will have a little money soon to maybe buy a little starter flock and go from there. I do like to shear with hand scissor shears. The last time I sheared my ewe I was on one side with regular hand shears and my friend was on the other side with real scissors. It worked fine. We were done in about an hour. I can't imagine doing a lot of sheep that way, though. Do you shear youself or have someone come in and do it for you?
Kris |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 08:01:37 AM
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Kris, sounds like you are well on your way.
I do shear all my animals and since I had a screwed up finger on my working right hand I can not hold electric shears, the vibration cramps my hand and I can't hold on to them. Not a good thing to do when have a sweet one in your hands. So I shear all my animals with scissors and I have profected it to almost an art. Icelandics break their fleece at a certain time of the year about two to three weeks before lambing. In Iceland they have a razor sharp knife and with the animal between their leggs they run that knife starting at the neck and like peeling an orange the fleece is shorn - it is real slick and I did the same with my flock. It really goes quickly. The reason they break the fleece is to shed it and once the lambs are born they hop up on mom's back and the fleece rolls up to keep them warm. Mother nature is wonderful.
Also, if you wish to have a book on the genetics,care, history and everything else of Icelandic Sheep, written by the heads of the Icelandic Sheep Bureau (I purchase three dozen when I was in Iceland)
I would gladly sell you one. I gave that book to folk who purchased flocks from me and it was my bible.
Thanks so much for the interest in Icelandic Sheep.
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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oldfashioned girl
True Blue Farmgirl
2391 Posts
monica
oatman
az
USA
2391 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 08:26:20 AM
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What breeds would do well in the desert? I am very interested in having even a few animals someday! I am interested in sheep, alpaca or goats! I just wonder though about the temperatures where I live because in the summer it can get up to 110 or hotter!
Monica
farmgirls rule!
www.justducky48.etsy.com |
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 08:31:44 AM
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Thanks for the history of your Icelandics, Grace. Interesting and sounds like you are setup nicely for sheep. May I ask why you sold your sheep?
Luna, enjoyed your story too as you researched and did your homework and made an informed decision. I don't care what breed people raise as long as they have a passion for it--you both have that.
You've both chosen good breeds for your markets and situations. I think that is the key thing here...identify your markets and if there isn't much, be willing to find a way to market your sheep. Otherwise, you've got too many mouths to feed quickly if you keep all offspring. Plus, then it's a hobby and not a business. Luna, how do you advertise your breeding stock for sale?
We wanted to raise an exceptional meat lamb and chose the Texel breed as a terminal sire on those first Suffolk ewes we had. Got great lambs but hated those ewes so switched to Coopworth ewes for their mothering abilities and wool quality and got some Texel ewes too to raise breeding stock. We started mostly marketing direct-market "locker lambs" and we got a premium price for them but found it was so labor intensive that the commercial markets were easier and "quick and dirty" and no muss, no fuss, so we're going in that direction. Of course we have the wool from our breeds too and are finding lots of interesting ways to use it. I too did a lot of research, visited Texel breeders and went to the National Sale in Sedalia, MO to check out many breeders at one time and attend their breed register meeting. We bought some nice Texels and have added nicer and nicer bloodlines each year through ram additions until now we're pretty much a closed flock. We sell terminal sire Texel rams and brood ewes. Luna, we have a ram of ours in Kentucky! I am trying to remember the town and I can't right now.
Most people find us through our website and online on the breeder's directory. Lots of repeat buyers. I'm the executive secretary for the Washington State Sheep Producers and have met most of the sheep folks in our state and the US too through our ASI affiliation. It's been a fun sheep life so far!
Grace, I love preparing for baby time too...it's like preparing a baby nursery and freshening it all up!
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 08:39:48 AM
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Hi Monica
You will have to spend a lot on keeping alpaca from getting heat stroke. My friends who live in your area and also in Texas have spent a fortune of air conditioned barns because those alpacas live in high cold climates. Even in Colorad we have to watch them during our summers, wading pools, sprinklers, fans and tons of shade. I have known of several alpacas who have died of heat storke here in Colorado, so be prepared to write big checks.
There are several sheep breeds that are more hair sheep like the California Reds who do well in the heat - you have to look for hair sheep. There are many out there.
As for Goats I guess you are talking about fiber goats - both Angora and Cashmere can do well in heat it is just a matter of management. Some of the largest herd of Cashmere are in Texas and the Native Americans always had Angora's but they are not the same type as what you might have seen. They have more of the nomatic heritage.
Once again research is where you start.
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 08:51:58 AM
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Monica, I know you're a spinner so you probably would want a wool sheep. Rambouillet or Merino sheep are more tolerant of heat than the average wool sheep. I would think shearing twice a year would be necessary and a constant shade source. My Texels are not that heat tolerant even though I got my original stock from Kansas where it can be very hot. My imported bloodlines from the UK and Netherlands are very heat intolerant! Those girls are the first to seek shade during a hot summer day.
Grace, you made me laugh--can you imagine paying an electric bill for AC for animals? Now that's pampering!
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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Suzan
True Blue Farmgirl
659 Posts
suzanne
duncannon
pa
USA
659 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 09:08:50 AM
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| Girls, Keep it going! I'm learning so much! And Grace, don't worry about it being lengthy, it is interesting!! |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 09:15:22 AM
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Jami I with you - I do not even have air conditioning for me - but remember some folks have more money then brains...
Monica another issue is when we have to shear twice a year because of heat you will not be getting the length that would be worth the price of raising them.. Also mills will not process to short of fleece if you go that route for a business..
Next point is the cold the environment the more fiber the animal produces. Common sense - right!!! I just love cold weather for alpacas because I would keep the records and in some cases we could almost double their fiber - also if the weather is too hot the animals over heat and their is breakage in the fiber thru that - not what you want in a fiber business. You also have to consider the bottom line - it if you spending all your money to keep them cool, you will be never in the black - stick with animals that will thrive in your environment that way you are having happy, healthy animals and your bottom line will be something that you can live with..
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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Jami
True Blue Farmgirl
1238 Posts
Jami
Ellensburg
WA
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 09:27:31 AM
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I agree with Grace about the trade-offs of shearing twice a year..was just trying to think of a solution for you Monica. I'd see if anyone has sheep around you and check out how they do it successfully.
Well put Grace, on the money than brains quote. That's one of my favorites too.
That said, I do have friends who shear their Border Leicesters more than once a year and they do okay as they get the staple length for mill requirements. Not sure if this is certain bloodlines or what. Maybe it's the cooler weather like Grace said.
Grace, did your Icelandics tolerate the heat of the summer? With their extreme cold hardiness, I just wonder.
Jami in WA
Farmgirl Sister #266
http://woolyinwashington.wordpress.com/
http://farmhouseflair.etsy.com |
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grace gerber
True Blue Farmgirl
2804 Posts
grace
larkspur
colorado
USA
2804 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 11:45:09 AM
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Jami I forgot to say you have a sound business plan and have really done your research. Join groups, National organization and such really helps in getting your business up and running.
To answer your question about why I sold my sheep that was a very hard long decission. First we are in a six year drought - we have lost all of my organic hay suppliers around here. When we started I could bring in two full semi loads of hay for what it now costs me to purchase three ton for the winter. I have always run an organic grass based operation so that was strick one. Next with the droughts came horrible fires and having to evacute 130 some animals at a moments notice and then finding places for them when thousands of animals where in the same boat. Also being organic that did not leave me many options - the stress of those evacutions took a huge toll on me and my animals. Stike two. Next my two sons and I ran this farm and the fiber business but as all things happen I raised them right and they created wonderful lives that did not mean they could reach their goals while working this farm - I love that they have spread their wings and are soaring. Strike three. That left one person running everything and no one is giving me more then 24 hours.. So I looked at what makes me money, what took more time then I had and made some hard decissions. As I stated earlier I made sure that the animals went for much more then I purchased them, that I had taught the new owners my managememt styles so the animals would thrive and last I also made contracts for the fiber. All in all I do not regret a moment - but I must say I do not miss all the work that sheep require and profits are not going to the hay man. If the economy changes and I had a work force I would have sheep in a heartbeat but for now my life is perfect. I have made hundreds of great sheep breeding friends who provide me with fleece - I might be coming your way Jami for fleece soon.
That brings me to my next question for the group - how do you feed you four legged friends - organic, hay based, grain or combo's? What does it cost you to feed you sweet ones a day???
Grace Gerber
Larkspur Funny Farm and Fiber Art Studio
Where the spirits are high and the fiber is deep
http://www.larkspurfunnyfarm.etsy.com
http://larkspurfunnyfarm.blogspot.com
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oldfashioned girl
True Blue Farmgirl
2391 Posts
monica
oatman
az
USA
2391 Posts |
Posted - Nov 10 2008 : 12:13:59 PM
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Thank you all for the incredible input! For lack of space I would love to someday have just a few fiber animals more to raise and have than to really go into business! I do know that there are some sheep farms in Kingman, 30 miles north of me, but the temperature there doesn't usually get above 100!
Grace, I heard this morning that there is a possibility that Bam Bam got loose! I am trying to reach Dan about putting up fliers so hopefully he will be found! I can't believe how attached I got to him!
Monica
farmgirls rule!
www.justducky48.etsy.com |
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Barnyard Buddies: All Things Sheep and Goats |
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All Things Sheep and Goats
