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Barnyard Buddies: Goat feeding question ![Next Topic Next Topic](icons/icon_go_right.gif) |
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LadyCrystal
True Blue Farmgirl
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593 Posts
Alicia
Rhode Island
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - Aug 18 2005 : 6:45:24 PM
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My Uncle-in-law just recently bought 2 nubian goats.They are so much fun.Last night we went to our local fair and I was looking at the 4-h projects.One was about foods poisonous to goats.The person had tomatoes listed.Is this true? Also what are some other "people" veggies that poisonous to them, we don't want to take any chances. Thanks so much, Alicia
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Aunt Jenny
True Blue Farmgirl
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11381 Posts
Jenny
middle of
Utah
USA
11381 Posts |
Posted - Aug 18 2005 : 7:28:40 PM
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I have always heard that about tomatoes...and since I don't share tomatoes..haha I guess it hasn't been a problem. I tend to turn the sheep and goats out into the big fenced garden area in the winter so I make sure all the tomato vines, even the dried up ones are out of there. I don't feed the goats cabbage although they may like it..because of the gas..don't give it to the bunnies either. Alot of things will give an off flavor to milk too..so I don't give my milk goats any treats that are strong flavored. I know iris' are supposed to be poisonous to goats too..mine are all out front. (the iris') If you stick with simple things and leafy veggies you will be okay usually. I know that wilted fruit tree leaves can be toxic too, so I never give the goats more than one fresh twig full of leaves at a time. I don't know if it is all fruit tree leaves but I don't take any chances.
Jenny in Utah The best things in life arn't things |
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theherblady
True Blue Farmgirl
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510 Posts
Jan
Glasford
Illinois
USA
510 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 07:31:13 AM
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Hi Jenny~~ What is a good thing to "bribe" the goats with.? I have trouble getting them back into the pen after grazing...I was told to try saltines...that they like the salt...but "the girls" werent impressed~~~I have a very strong willed "teenager" I think and she is getting very hard to handle. Used to mind quite well, but now she bolts out the pen gate and although I have her on a lead~~she about pulls me over !! They love hay...but not enough to follow it back to the pen...Help Me Please!! Jan |
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WisGal35
True Blue Farmgirl
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99 Posts
Cathy
Kenosha County
WI
USA
99 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 07:43:13 AM
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Thanks for the tip on tomatoes, I had no idea! A few days ago, I gave my two goats (Alpines) a few handfuls of leaves & stalks & green tomatos I broke off while weeding. Or maybe its that my goats are large, so the small amount didn't hurt. I won't give them more.
Jan-We let our goats graze freely on the property, too. One is a 3-yr-old wether, the other an elderly doe. The best trick I've found is to shake a grain scoop with a little grain in it for them (we have it on hand for the horses). They come running :) Practice leading with that naughty girl of yours - don't want anybody getting hurt. I was told to teach them to lead, have one person lead, and have another stand behind and use their tail to 'direct' by picking it up (not a lot of pressure, though). Seemed to work OK. |
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prairiemaid
True Blue Farmgirl
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200 Posts
Margret
Canada
200 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 07:47:41 AM
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I happen to have a list in a word document on my computer! I've copy and pasted it here for you:
Poisonous Plants for Goats
·Caladium (all parts) ·Castor Bean (seed, leaves) ·Christmas Rose (root, leaves, sap) ·Dieffenbachia (all parts) ·Philodendron (all parts0 ·Mistletoe (berries) ·Rosary Pea (seeds) ·Autumn Crocus (all, esp. bulb) ·Bleeding Heart (leaves, roots) ·Dutchman's Breeches (leaves, roots) ·Foxglove (leaves) ·Larkspur (all; seeds) ·Lily of the Valley (all) ·Monkshood (all) ·Narcissus (all) ·Daffodil (all) ·Jonquil (all) ·Potatoes (all green parts) ·Rhubarb (leaves) ·Tomato (leaves) ·Apple (large amount of seeds) ·Apricot (seed) ·Almond (seed) ·Avocado (leaves) ·Azalea (all) ·Black Locust (bark, twigs, seeds) ·Boxwood (leaves, twigs) ·Buckeye (leaves, nuts, flowers, sprouts) ·Horsechestnut (same) ·Chinaberry (furit, bark, berries) ·Chokecherry (leaves, seeds, bark) ·Wild Black Cherry (same) ·English Holly (berries) ·Oaks (tannins in foliage and acorns) ·Oleander (all including dried leaves) ·Privet (leaves, berries) ·Rhododendron (all parts) ·Yew (all, esp. berries) ·Daphne (all; fruit) ·English Ivy (berries, leaves) ·Golden Chain (seeds, pods, flowers) ·Lantana (green berries, leaves) ·Mountain Laurel (all even honey from flowers is toxic) ·Yellow Jasmine (all, including nectar and roots) ·Wisteria (pods, seeds) ·Buttercup (all) ·Cone Flower (all) ·Black-eyed Susan (all) ·Hemlock (seeds, stems, fleshy taproot often mistaken for wild parsnip or anise) ·Jack-in-the-pulpit (all) ·Jimson Weed (all--very dangerous drug too often used by teens) ·Amanita Mushrooms (all) ·Nightshade (all) ·American Bittersweet (berries, roots, leaves) ·Deadly Nightshade (all) ·Pokeweed (roots, shoots, leaves) ·White Snakeroot (all parts) ·Morning Glory (seeds) ·Tobacco (leaves) ·Tulip (bulbs) ·Iris (corms)
This is not a complete list but covers most of the worst ones. Note that poinsettia is not considered toxic.
theherblady, how many goats have you got? I have six and I find that it really works to use the herd mentality. If there is one goat you can get a hold of and run with her, the rest will follow. You can try running yourself or with another person. Use lots of leg movements to look like you are running fast but go slow. They should follow! I buy a sweet feed especially for goats that has all their vitamins and minerals etc. It's a mixture coated in molasses. They love it!
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Aunt Jenny
True Blue Farmgirl
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11381 Posts
Jenny
middle of
Utah
USA
11381 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 08:55:19 AM
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My goats will fun for a bucket with a little grain in it. They also love apple tree twigs with leaves attached, or dandelion leaves. My goats are not nuts about crackers either..but I have known friend's goats who loved them. I think grain is your best bet. They always consider that a treat. I mix my own usually, but the base is a corn/oats/ barley with mollasses from the feed store.Once they know what you always have in the bucket (or can) you just need a handful in it and they will come to you for sure.
Jenny in Utah The best things in life arn't things |
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theherblady
True Blue Farmgirl
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510 Posts
Jan
Glasford
Illinois
USA
510 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 10:19:24 AM
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Thanks for the suggestions~~! I only have 2 and if the youngest is mis-behaving...then the other doesnt think she has to mind either. I tried the bucket thing and they werent interested in it after I closed the lid...and they realized they couldnt open it...I give them corn and the mollasses feed once a day , usually after we get done with our "walk" and I have tried to coax them with it and usually works...but they wont leave me alone long enough to dish out dinner...They are in a nice size pen, but of course, they wont eat the grass in there so I have to take them out for a walk since we dont have pasture to put them in...Maybe if I put some in my pocket-they will follow me into the pen at least long enough so I can dish up the food... Any other suggestions on bribe food would be great!! Margret...Is there anything about "Good" weeds? I am thinking I need to plant a little grazing spot and maybe fence it in? Not sure what I would plant.. Thanks gals~~~ Jan |
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LadyCrystal
True Blue Farmgirl
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593 Posts
Alicia
Rhode Island
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 2:49:28 PM
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Thanks everyone this is some great info.I have another question.His goats are 4 and 5 months old.They are not halter trained.I have trained cows in the past to lead on the halter would it basically be the same for the goats?My Uncle is in his 70's and he needs my help with them.When they are older he wants to be able to milk them.Is there was to pre train them for that?Thanks again, Alicia
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Aunt Jenny
True Blue Farmgirl
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Jenny
middle of
Utah
USA
11381 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 5:51:55 PM
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I just grab mine by the collar (they all wear one) and they walk a long side me. To pre train them for milking, I put them up on the stand daily to eat their grain and get brushed and all and it sure makes it alot easier when they kid...they WANT to get up there to get the grain. It is good to get them used to being handled each day.
Jenny in Utah The best things in life arn't things |
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LadyCrystal
True Blue Farmgirl
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593 Posts
Alicia
Rhode Island
USA
593 Posts |
Posted - Aug 19 2005 : 7:15:34 PM
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They wear a collar now so it would be easy to do.They are very tame and love attention.They love their grain so that should be easy to get them started on traing.I found out tonight he is getting another little one in a few weeks.He asked if I wanted one but I have so many chickens,turkeys and the cows I have my hands full.I said I just will visist his but I have been down to see them every day lol.Thanks again for the info. Alicia
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DeeHarp
Farmgirl in Training
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39 Posts
Dee
Missouri
39 Posts |
Posted - Aug 21 2005 : 10:33:55 AM
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Great Information here ladies! Thanks for the list of poisonous plants! I have a question...What is your grain mix and ration? Just wondering what works for each of you. Dee :-)
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LJRphoto
True Blue Farmgirl
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760 Posts
Laura
Hickory Corners
MI
USA
760 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2005 : 02:54:01 AM
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What do you all do about getting poisonous plants out of your pastures? I don't know if we have any jimson in our field, but I've seen a lot of pokeberry around the barn. I just don't think that I can walk around 9 acres digging up poisonous plants. Also, we have a lot of apple trees at the back of our property, do I need to worry about these for goats?
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." -Mark Twain |
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citygoatlady
True Blue Farmgirl
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82 Posts
82 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2005 : 03:55:17 AM
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I've found over the 12 years that my goats decide what is poisonous or not, and they won't eat what they don't like. I don't do anything about it. They have a half acre. Mine are well fed on alfalfa hay, and grain. Maybe if they are underfed they would overeat the poisonous things.
However, I would NEVER feed any animal Oleander. When I was a kid, my aunt in Texas had those. She said, a bowl of water placed under an oleander bush would kill a dog. She said a leaf would kill a child. Is this true? They don't grow here native, but are increasingly used as large potted ornamentals in front of stores. I would not try feeding yew either.
As far as the other things, here's my experience:
We have had jimson weed growing in the pen, and they won't eat it. They only eat the tips of stinging nettle. They refuse to eat thistle, which they are reputed to clear out of a pasture!
They relish a lot of the plants on that list of plants and plant parts which are indeed poisonous to people. Some of those plants like rododendron or jasmine are for a warmer climate zone than central Missouri where I live (zone 6), so I don't have them.
They eat iris leaves which they snatch through the fence. I try to guard the rhizomes for myself!
Oak branches with small acorns, or not, is a favorite, and I feel lucky when branches fall down and I can feed them. I pour bags of raked fall leaves into their pens, and get my neighbors to dump their leaves there, for the goats to enjoy.
(I have heard that goats can get clogged up and die if you feed them a lot of raked up mature acorns.)
They didn't used to eat the pokeberry, but one hungry year they started and there never has been an ill effect.
They relish tomatoes and tomato vines. I hang all of them over the fence when I pull them up.
We have a huge wild cherry tree over the yard. They do eat the leaves which fall if they want to.
When I cut down all my dwarf fruit trees which never gave fruit, except to the squirrels, the goats ate the leaves, bark and all from peaches, cherries and other stone fruits (said to be poisonous). Of course, the apple bark and twigs are not poisonous.
Yes, apple seeds contain cyanide, or is it arsenic. It would be really hard to feed a cup or two of that to your goats, unless you gave them cores leftover from canning. I've never seen them eat a peach pit. I do give them some apple cores.
My goats refuse to eat buttercup, deadly nightshade, morning glory.
People say honeysuckle is poisonous to goats too. Mine eat any quantity, no problem.
What we refer to as American bittersweet (eunymous) is a big weed here, and my goats love it.
Goats are valuable for eating poison ivy. I've read, and obviously it's true, that goat saliva denatures the poison ivy poison. I've heard if you have poison ivy, get a goat to lick it (I guess by putting molasses on your skin). I never tried that. I did get my worst case ever of poison ivy by holding a goat on my lap that had been walking in and eating poison ivy. Got it over about 50% of my body. I used Homeopathic Croton Tiglium 12x against that, and it helped a lot, taking a piece whenever I itched.
I wonder why anyone would say goats should not eat coneflower (echinacea) when that is the same echinacea we eat and use as tea? The whole plant is edible. I give it to them in tea, but wouldn't waste the leaves on the goats if I was harvesting it for us. I think black eyed susans are in the same family.
OVEREATING is what I watch out for more, and that is apt to happen when they aren't getting enough other feed. Once a goat overate box elder (slippery elm). It's not poisonous, but we had a huge pile of it from trimming a downed tree. She was laying down, groaning, and trying to climb into a corner. Cured with Homeopathic Nux Vomica, but it took a few days and was scary. She would never touch that again, even though she had been fine on it before and the other goats still ate it. I think she developed a thiamine deficiency, which recurred a few more times in her life.
I guess you have to watch your goats and see if they have any sense. Sometimes the poisonous plant list is drawn up for cows, and they are reprinted so much nobody knows where they came from. That list Prairiemaid wrote is indeed a list of poisonous plants. But I have never seen one specifically for goats which is footnoted, or has references, from a reputable researcher. Unfortunately, lot of info about goats lacks any scientific back up.
I never give the poisonous plant thing a thought, at least not with the plants we have here. LJR, with 9 acres to choose from, if it were my goats, I would expect them to choose something good. |
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Barn Goddess
Farmgirl in Training
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29 Posts
Mary Jane
Henry
Virginia
USA
29 Posts |
Posted - Aug 22 2005 : 06:26:44 AM
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Good information! My goats love mimosa and dogwood tree leaves. They can strip a tree in no time. I don't worry about poisonous plants either. The vet did tell me they shouldn't be allowed to eat red clover. Fortunately there isn't any in the pasture. |
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fiddlegirl
Farmgirl in Training
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24 Posts
Deborah
Clymer
PA
USA
24 Posts |
Posted - Sep 04 2005 : 8:24:41 PM
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I've found too that the goats avoid eating poisonous things all by themselves. And I think the ladies are correct that sometimes if the goats are too hungry they might eat the bad stuff. We have free choice hay for ours, grain in small amounts for kids and wethers (low protein) and larger amounts for milkers. Deb |
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sunflowercritters
True Blue Farmgirl
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1102 Posts
Debra
Springfield
Maine
USA
1102 Posts |
Posted - Feb 16 2009 : 1:19:28 PM
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Hi all I'm fairly new farmgirl sister and Just was wandering if you have tried giving raisns to your goats. mine love this as a treat. they cann't get into barn fast enough. they are so..much fun I have three milkers and 2 kids and a male goat for breeding. question do any of you make goat soap/soft chees? have receipts to share? also have a question on hard cheese, I cann't seem to get the hang of it. farmgirl sister #462
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shepherdgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
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1008 Posts
Tracy
California
USA
1008 Posts |
Posted - Feb 16 2009 : 7:43:12 PM
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My goats LOOOOOVE raisins too! I also give them horse cookies (the raisin/molasses kind). I swear they can SMELL the cookies in my pockets! A lot of times if I give a goody to just ONE goat, the others will want some too and everybody follows me like the pied piper back to where they're supposed to be.
As for the poisonous stuff-- my goats steer clear of those things too. Like it was metnioned before, a well fed goat tends to ignore what it shouldn't eat.
Oh, and I've heard that ONION skins (and probably the REST of the onion) should never be fed to goats either.
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. ~~ George Carlin |
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kristin sherrill
True Blue Farmgirl
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kristin
chickamauga
ga
USA
11303 Posts |
Posted - Feb 16 2009 : 7:53:51 PM
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My goats are pretty picky girls. They eat honeysuckle like crazy. they love it. They also like apple trees.The other day I let them in the ard. I have boxwood in the garden and they went right for it, but they sniffed it and left it alone. I think some things they just know are bad for them. Goats are pretty smart. And about onions. We went out back Sunday and the goats went crazy over all the wild onions in the field. They fight over them. I try not to go back there after they kid and I'm milking. Very nasty tasting milk then. But they love the wild onions and have never gotten sick from them.
What kind of goats do you have, Debra? I have Lamancha and one Nubian. I have made feta and hard cheese. And mozarella and ricotta, too. Very time consuming. I have not made soap yet. A friend of mine does so I get it from her.
Kris
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Edited by - kristin sherrill on Feb 16 2009 7:57:05 PM |
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nampafarmgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
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494 Posts
Kim
Nampa
ID
USA
494 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2009 : 07:03:22 AM
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I dont think I saw Hemlock (either one) on anyones poison list. When I prune cherry or apple trees, I give my goats the branches to eat off of, its really good for their digestive system to be able to eat on branches. Dont let them have wilted cherry tree leaves, they are supposed to give off a cyanide. My goats (pigmy/nubian mix) too are pretty smart, they either smell or maybe get a small taste of a plant they do not like and they wont eat it unless thats all theyre being offered.
Regarding trainign them, I call out their names and ask them if they want grain. They come running to me then. I dont give them molasses grain any longer. Supposedly, the molasses is not good for a banded goat, it clogs their urethra and give them the feeling of passing stones.
They also know other words as well, like 'do you want to go to your tree'. I ask that to them , they come runnign out of their pen and we walk to the lower pasture to their tree. As soon as I start walking to the house, they come running, they like to stay with me wherever I am at when they are out of their pen. If I am at the house on the deck,so are they. But to be sure they cme back, our house yard has no fences, I always have a handful of grain in my pocket to get them back.
Enjoy them.
Kim Farmgirl Sister # 302 |
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shepherdgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
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1008 Posts
Tracy
California
USA
1008 Posts |
Posted - Feb 17 2009 : 2:10:00 PM
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Grain, period, isn't good for wethers. A treat of it now and then is fine, but regular feeding can cause "Urinary Calculi," (Or "water belly") a VERY PAINFUL, and sometimes fatal condition. Something in the grain causes mineral buildup in the urethra tubes of wethers and they have a hard time going pee. In severe cases they can't pee at all and their bellies swell up ("water belly") and it causes their bladder to rupture. My research showed that it's often due to male goats being wethered too young-- but is anyone ever REALLY sure of the cause of things? Regardless of the cause, moderation is the key. If they're getting good feed, have the supplements available that they need, then they really don't need grain anyway. It's just something people THINK they need to feed them!
My goats, (and other critters), get grain only as a treat, (and to bribe them if necessary!). Although, I AM giving my nursing does a bit of grain a couple times of week. They are all nursing multiple kids (and some kids are nursing from multiple moms!!! LOL!!), so I feel they deserve a bit of extra energy for their efforts. And they do LOVE IT!
Oh, and Kristin, I think the "No onion" thing was about onions with skins-- like white, yellow and purple onions. I guess there's a difference between "Wild Onions" and commercially grown onions. But, like you said, the goats will eat what THEY think is good for them. Seems we humans can only GUESS whats good and what's not. But, my creedo is-- "when in doubt, RIP IT OUT!!!" (LOL!!) Better to be safe than sorry!
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. ~~ George Carlin |
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sunflowercritters
True Blue Farmgirl
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1102 Posts
Debra
Springfield
Maine
USA
1102 Posts |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 7:33:56 PM
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Hi Kristin, I have Alpine pure breed and Nubian pure breed and some that mix with alpine and nubian I also have one ToggonBerg goat. All together I have two males four females. And three of my moms are going to kid out month or two. They are so much fun i just love my goats they are so..loving. I will be showing couple of my friends how to make goat milk soap on Monday. Cann't wait it is so. much fun to make. Have a great evening farmgirl sister #462
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southerncrossgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
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631 Posts
Gena
Harmony
NC
USA
631 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2009 : 04:06:26 AM
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Hi Kristin, I have tried in the past to make cheese. I am not sure what kind I was trying to make. I just know it was soft. It had only garlic powder added, and I didn't like the taste at all. Is there another simple receipe that I can try? I used to make goatmilk soap alot. I really need to make some now. It sure is alot of trouble, but you can't beat it. It lasts a long time also
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southerncrossgirl
True Blue Farmgirl
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631 Posts
Gena
Harmony
NC
USA
631 Posts |
Posted - Feb 19 2009 : 04:11:54 AM
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Hi Tracey, Regarding grain and goats, do you think that bucks would be okay without grain? We have had 2 bucks in the past to die of that awful disease. It was such a horrible death. I have been told if there was this certain ingredient in the minerals, they should be fine. I can't remember the ingredient, but I know it is in the minerals I order from "Hoegger". The minerals are the "Golden Blend". I haven't had any trouble since
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