| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 05:31:45 AM
My uncoordinated Shepherd mix bit me last night. It's my fault - I bought a bag of kibble since the girls will be staying at a kennel for a few days around Christmas. Our house is all of 400 square feet, and I stupidly didn't clear a closet to put the bag in right away and just set it on the kitchen floor.
Well Stuie (Miss Food Obsessed) knew what it was and headed for the bag right away. Cookie (Miss Curious) wanted to check it out too and Stuie started growling at her. I told Stu to knock it off and ordered her away from the bag. Stuie started to comply, but when she got close to Cookie (who was now behind me) she lunged and started a snip-fight. Well uncoordinated Cookie thought to defend herself as she saw the attack coming - and bit me instead! The dogs are fine. Not a scratch. It was just a territorial food snap.
My jeans (very glad I was in jeans) are torn and I have four deep punctures - and a lot of bruising. It bled for hours (I mean, running down the leg bleeding). I've washed it out twice with peroxide and put neosporin on it twice as well. Anything else I should do, or watch out for? It's closed up this morning but I'm limping pretty bad - it hurts more than I think it should.
Oh and the food is in the closet now  |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 21 2005 : 04:54:30 AM
Connie - thank you for taking that brindle pit in! Poor baby! They either didn't like the puppies she'd had an turned her loose, or she was one smart girl and figured out how to escape (many pitties are escape artists). I've had a few pitties show up at my door - Stuie is a red-nose mix that I don't think was ever abused before she just followed me on my morning walk one day.
Toby was a red-nose with gorgeous yellow eyes - he had deep punctures all over him and was wearing one of those ugly "break collars" used in fighting - but he was just the friendliest boy! At the time I didn't want two dogs, and Stuie doesn't seem to care for males. So we fattened him up and found him a happy home - some folks' red-nose dog had died the year before, they had loved that dog to pieces and asked me "does he have yellow eyes?" They also had five acres for him to run in.
There are so many babies like these needing homes.
Patricia, I agree. Some people shouldn't breed either. Unfortunately, it seems the wrong kind of people tend to breed the most. :S |
| Utahfarmgirl |
Posted - Dec 20 2005 : 3:44:50 PM
Hey, Connie ~ no, you doing have to do the blub thing. You are working with Universal energy - the stuff that everything in the universe is made of, including us. (basic fact of physics)Each vibration has a color associated with it (more physics). Blue is peace and healing, pink is love, white is protection, green is prosperity, etc. Surround your subject (animal or human) either by looking at him or in your mind (which is how I do it. I see better with my eyes closed for things like this) with the light, see it go through, in and around him and talk to him, telling him what is appropriate, ("You are loved", "This is your forever home", "I'm surrounding you with peacefulness, I'm surrounding you with healing," etc.). Do it for as long as your intuition tells you to and do it often. I've seen real miracles happen. Merry Christmas!
Happy Wishes! |
| connio |
Posted - Dec 20 2005 : 3:02:58 PM
Hey Farm Girls!!!
Patricia Can you bring me "up to speed" on the blue and pink lights? I know that blue lights are healing and pink symbolizes love, but should I be using these bulbs all over the house if the pets have free run of the house?
I have a brindle pit named Little Debbie Mae who showed up at my home in Dallas about 3 years ago and is now about 5 years old. She was covered with scabs and had been nursing pups. She clearly had been trained to fight. She is doing better and is my Alpha, but I still have to watch her all of the time. She does quite well with the males, but plays with only one of my other female dogs.
I guess that I could live with blue and pink lights everywhere--might make life even more interesting!!!!!! I already decorate with lots of blue.
Connie
cozycottage |
| Utahfarmgirl |
Posted - Dec 20 2005 : 1:25:52 PM
As a pet communicator, I just want to add that I had another purebred doggie's mom call me in for consult this week. Casper's perfectly fine but will suddenly become aggressive for no reason. Mom couldn't understand why he was so affectionate with me because strangers drive him crazy, again, for no reason. It comes with the territory, of course. I see it all the time. When I did the medical scan, I found that he had genetic "crossed wiring" just like the others I've seen over the years. There's nothing you can do for it except Blue Light and Pink Light for love, but medically, there's nothing. It just breaks my heart. Casper doesn't know why he acts like that, doesn't want to act like that, and hates himself for acting like that and it's not his fault. If only breeders could see beyond the money! I'm not saying all breeders are like that, of course, but unscrupulous people see puppy mill breeding as a source of easy cash. They don't care about the dogs or the people who love them. Gotta go now before my blood pressure goes up. Lynn, thank you for speaking up. I would add that some people shouldn't be allowed to breed thmselves either.
Patricia
Happy Wishes! |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 20 2005 : 09:31:54 AM
Robin, there are a lot of things I wish backyard breeders understood.
Like not breeding an agressive dog - just because those brindle puppies will bring you 1K each doesn't mean you don't have a responsibility to see what KIND of temperment you are reproducing and setting free into the world, for some other backyard breeder to do the same with.
Or not breeding a dog just because she is in her first heat. She is still a puppy when she has that first heat, still growing and developing - and sometimes young mothers have less patience than one with a little more time to grow up has.
Or not getting your dogs neutered because "only sissy boys neuter their dogs.. real men have real dogs..."
Or being lazy about getting your dogs fixed, and not caring about the resulting puppies. I am sure both my dogs came from this kind of household. I have an idea where Cookie came from (Cooks belonged to our tenants before we evicted them and they left her behind - she was 5 months old then). I know I saw Cookie as a puppy there in January 03 at about 4 weeks. She belonged to the tenant's sister, who had given away her dog's puppies.
I could go on, I am tired of the abuse so many dogs take. I love pitties but am right now avoiding the pit bull forum because, after so many sad articles, it gets to be too much to take and one must take a break. Anybody hear about the pit bull puppy found a few weeks ago in Zephyrhills - someone had pulled her tounge out, clamped her teeth down on top of it, and held her mouth shut with her teeth through her tongue with a rubber band. On top of that, she had two broken legs. The carpenter that rescued her is keeping her - but she has lost 2/3 of her tongue - there were maggots in it. It just gets to be too much after a while.
Stupid people shouldn't own dogs. I don't care if we have to pass some kind of test to find out what kind of owners we would be in order to have a dog - but I am starting to think, for the sake of our animals, something this drastic should be done. |
| ThymeForEweFarm |
Posted - Dec 20 2005 : 09:14:53 AM
>>>taken from her mother and siblings too young, so she never got to play like other young dogs do, learning things like bite inhibition or even how to read another dog's language. <<<
I wish everyone understood this. Pups need to stay with their mothers for at least eight weeks. There are a lot of lessons to be learned in a very short amount of time. In Maine it's illegal to take pups and kittens away from their mothers until their eight weeks. I like 10 weeks.
Robin
www.thymeforewe.com
www.farm-garden.com/robin |
| Horseyrider |
Posted - Dec 20 2005 : 08:09:17 AM
Oh lordy, I hit my leg once with a hammer, too! I was trying to clear out a stall in the barn that the previous owners had filled with trusses from the chicken coop, so I was breaking them up with a hammer. I had one positioned next to my leg, swung hard, and missed and hit my knee. Had that short little interval of no pain so I could tell myself, 'That one's gonna hurt BAD,' and then the pain came waving in. Owwwww!!! I was lucky to do no real damage, but it swelled up like a rubber raft! Ooh, I was lucky!
I'm glad you're taking care to investigate your dog's behavior fully and objectively. Just the fact that you're being objective means a LOT. This way the odds are best for success for you. Let us know how it goes, 'kay? |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 19 2005 : 12:56:28 PM
Actually MaryAnn, I HAVE hit my leg with a hammer - I was working on building something and (can't remember how) the hammer bounced back and the forked part hit my leg pretty hard. I was bruised, and you could see a dent where the prongs had hit - but it's nothing like a pinch on the soft part of your leg!
I asked my dog training forum about "displacement biting" and they said in her case, it could certainly be what happened. Someone suggested getting a behaviorist and I may do that, just so I'm not making any mistakes here. I *think* by removing all the temptation, we'll avoid any future porblems - but who is to say Stuie won't instigate something with a toy one day? They have a tug of war rope that they are allowed to play with for a short amount of time every few days - I cut it short because after having it for an hourlong game between them (I don't play competitive games with my dogs), I don't like the tone of the growl Stuie gets sometimes, so I take it away and put it up. Otherwise, they really don't have any toys other than a ball and a Kong, which don't seem to have any issues attatched to them.
They did say displacement biting is common, and that nearly every dog, in some circumstance, might bite. I didn't know Cookie had a button before, but if this is the case, now I do, and I need to learn more about it. |
| Horseyrider |
Posted - Dec 19 2005 : 12:12:46 PM
Lynn, it sounds like you have a good handle on things, and you clarified a lot for me. I just worry about people who misinterpret their animal's intentions. There are plenty out there that do that, with tragic results. I'm relieved to hear that it really was likely just a goof, and not wishful thinking on the humom's part.
And I'm glad to hear your leg's getting better! I've been bitten pretty hard too; it feels like it'd be easier to get your leg hit with a hammer, eh? I hope you continue to recover, and to enjoy your kids with fur! |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 19 2005 : 10:29:47 AM
Hi Mary Ann,
Thankfully, no, I don't have kids. Don't plan on having any either!
I also take a very hard-lined view of my dogs, and how they behave. I will NEVER keep a human-aggressive dog. If I thought anyone was in danger around my dogs, I don't think I could be stressing over worrying about something happening one day. There are too many perfectly good dogs being PTS every day for me to be keeping one like that.
Cookie has never shown any sign of aggression. I really believe this was an accidental bite. She is not coordinated in the slightest. She was malnourished as a puppy, taken from her mother and siblings too young, so she never got to play like other young dogs do, learning things like bite inhibition or even how to read another dog's language. We actually had to work on teaching bite inhibition ourselves when we first got her, she simply didn't know what was too hard. Our other dog had to work with her too. Stupid stuff like not knowing NOT to step on us or Stuie had to be corrected. Believe me - she doesn't have a dominant bone in her body - she's just that dumb.
To make it harder as a puppy, with the malnourishment she didn't have the energy to learn as a young dog. For the first few months we had her, we called her "the rug" because she didn't get up much.
She is not a resource guarder. I can take ANYTHING away from her at any time. Chicken parts, you name it. I've found her to be extremely reliable - and now that she is healthy, is learning how to handle trail commands and help me on hikes. Not that I do it much, but I have found her very good off-leash as well, she can be walked without one (only do that in the remote wilderness!!), can be let off in unfamiliar environments and still knows and follows every command.
I know Stuie would fall into the category you describe if it had been her. If Stuie were ever to bite, I know she MEANT to. She has excellent bite inhibition, coordination, and can read any incoming dog very quickly to determine "threat or not" - often before I am sure myself. (we have a lot of loose dogs in our neighborhood). Her exactness is impressive. She is, however, a food hoarder. We can take food away from her though (IMHO, if you cannot take food away from your dog, you are NOT Alpha).
The mistake in this incident was I should have sent Cookie (the cause of Stuie's food hoarding) out of the room and THEN sent Stuie away from the food. I did not expect Stuie to lash out at Cookie - I know she waited until she had walked past me and must have felt she was following my command and wanted to "follow the chain down the line" and take care of making sure Cookie understood SHE meant for Cookie to go away.
If I were to blame either dog, I put the fault on Stu - because she should not have started a fight.
Either dog, by themselves, is fine. Together, 99.9% of the time, they are fine - they play and sleep on each other and are good old pals. Stu is obsessed with food though - we feed the girls in two separate rooms because we could forsee this as a problem one day.
My leg is healing fine, BTW. The brusing is nearly gone and two of the four punctures are healed entirely. It wasn't as deep as I had initially thought. |
| Horseyrider |
Posted - Dec 17 2005 : 04:52:50 AM
Lynn, I totally understand your feeling about not wanting to start any problems with the authorities. I don't know if you have children at home, but if you do, you might consider keeping this dog kenneled or away from them. From what I understand from people who train working dogs (detection dogs for narcotics, explosives, etc, police dogs, search and rescue dogs, schutzhund dogs) this was not a mistake. This dog just had some aggression and temper, and you were the closest target on which to discharge that aggression. He wanted to discharge it NOW, and you were the one. Rather than bite the alpha dog, he bit you, someone he views as less than alpha. Behaviorists call this a displacement activity. Kind of like if your husband gets yelled at by his boss, he can't yell back; so he comes home and yells at the kids, someone with lesser status in the hierarchy. He does it because he can. This is a very bad thing. Dogs that are trained for bite work don't bite unless commanded to, and they only go for areas they're trained to get. And they release immediately when told. There's no anger or passion in it, other than the passion for a job well done.
You may be alpha in the pack in every respect, except when food is concerned, or when tempers flare. Then all bets are off. And if you are beta during these times, then other people and children are definitely beta or even omega during other times. If you've ever seen a child who has been the victim of a dog attack, you'd take me seriously here. It happens in a flash, and there's often no precipitating event.
I had a little Corgi that had been known to bite during excitment, such as somebody coming and knocking at a certain door. I got around it by ordering a down/stay when I'd go to answer it. But once my husband forgot when going to answer the door, and he was bitten hard. Tore his jeans and left him bruised and bleeding. I had my best friend take my little dog to the vet to be PTS. It broke my heart, but I have two little grandsons. While I'd always kept them separate from the dog, that sort of bite is a dealbreaker. I just couldn't take the chance. While dogs'll go for the legs and hands of adults, they go for the heads and necks of children.
BTW, my vet would tell you to not use hot compresses on this type of injury. While we normally use this sort of thing to draw out abcesses and such, the heat also increases circulation in the area, which will accelerate the spread of any infection.
I hope you can take a good hard, objective look at your situation. My heart goes out to you; I know you love your dog. But this is deadly serious stuff, especially when it involves such a powerful breed.
(((((HUGS)))))
|
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 15 2005 : 04:48:13 AM
Susan, that was me. This has been a rough year - in early summer I herniated a disk and pulled a ligament in my back, and with the spasms that wouldn't stop, I was immobile for 3 months. Still healing from that too, recovery has been slow.
Hoping 2006 will be better for a lot of us - several of us farmgirls have had a very difficult year. |
| gothique |
Posted - Dec 14 2005 : 9:41:51 PM
Lynn, you said that the punctures "bled and bled". Well, for clearing out germs and whatever other ugly things cling to doggie teeth, that was a GOOD thing. It probably wouldn't hurt to talk to your nurse neighbor, either.
Yeasties (or was that someone else) and now dog bite? I hope things lighten up for you soon!
Susan
"Take care of the luxuries, and the necessities will take care of themselves."
-- Oscar Wilde |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 14 2005 : 4:57:32 PM
I almost went to the doctor today as I started to feel like I was fighting something off - wasn't sure if it was a sign of infection or just part of the cold I've been fighting for a while. It went away before I was ready to go out the door and hasn't been back since, and the wound looks fine yet - no red marks or swelling, and the bruising, while still a sight to behold, is looking a bit better today too.
I'm also concerned that if I go to a doctor - my homeowner's insurance might get involved. I have heard of people ordered to get rid of the dog or they'll lose the insurance, so - I'm just keeping an eye on everything and hoping all will be well. I love my uncoordinated doggie - she's my snuggle baby, my hiking companion and a total sweetheart. |
| Eileen |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 5:05:55 PM
Lynn,
Puncture wounds do need air! Can get infected pretty fast and might require antibiotics. The registering thing when a dog bites is mostly for if your dog bites a non house member. My cat bit me pretty seriously last spring(long story) and I was told when I called the doctor that I would have to fill out a cat bite form but after I got to the doctors office and they had established that my animals were up to date on all shots and I told them the whole story they told me that I did not have to file the form since it was my own animal.
Eileen
Songbird; singing joy to the earth |
| DaisyFarm |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 10:19:26 AM
Lynn..I agree with Mary. While bandaids certainly serve their purpose, they also provide a nice, warm and moist breeding ground for bacteria.
Hot wet compresses will draw infection out, but do let they dry well afterwards. Watch for the area around the bites to become warm...feel with the inside of your wrist. That's your best indicator of infection.
Take care of yourself...so sorry for your owie!!
|
| quilt8305 |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 09:23:51 AM
Lynn, Good 'old fashioned air' never hurt much of anything that I know of. I would remove the bandaids if you can keep the area clean - maybe just cover with plain gauze to protect it. Sounds like you did a good job. The bruising will go away after a while, but keep an eye on it.
Mary
The great use of life is to spend it for something that will outlast it. Wm. James |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 09:06:19 AM
Mary - should I remove the band-aids to help the punctures drain? No redness or red streaks that I can tell - most of the area is very much purple today. I don't think it is swollen. DH helped me with cleaning it up - he made sure he got the peroxide in there pretty good, and both times we made sure the neosporin was in the punctures.
A hot bath sounds lovely.
Robin - I haven't heard of Icthamol, but was wondering if there was something out there that would have a "drawing" effect. I'll ask DH to look for it. :) |
| ThymeForEweFarm |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 08:44:24 AM
Lynn, have you thought of Icthamol? It's a drawing salve. It might be helpful if your wounds show any signs of redness and/or heat. Watch for fever.
Robin
www.thymeforewe.com
www.farm-garden.com/robin |
| quilt8305 |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 08:44:12 AM
Lynn, I operated a dog and cat boarding kennel for eleven years. Puncture wounds are the worst. You need to keep it open if you can so it can drain, especially if you did not put the antibiotic ointment in the puncture itself - it needs to heal inside. We usually had bites on our hands so they were easy to soak - maybe this is an excuse for a nice hot bath.................. Please watch carefully for infection (redness, swelling, red streaks)and it probably would not hurt to get some antibiotics into you orally. I sympathize - it hurts like the dickens! 
Mary
The great use of life is to spend it for something that will outlast it. Wm. James |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 08:00:10 AM
Susan, SO sorry to hear about your kitty! How awful!
BSL is Breed Specific Legislation. It comes in a variety of forms, but the worst happens in places like Denver. Earlier this year Denver passed a ban on all pit bulls - and they were forcibly removed from people's homes. What angers me is they went after the responsible owners who had registered and took care of their dogs - these were house dogs, family pets - those went first. It's easier to get those dogs than the ones in areas where dogfighting (and most incidents) happens. It opens the door to banning Rottweilers (which, raised properly, are lazy teddy bears), German Shepherds (police dogs!) etc. The list of potentially bannable dogs is quite long. I found a list a few months ago, and even pugs were on the list of "frequently biting dogs" that could become banned.
I'm very passionate about this because Stuie is a pit mix - and potentially bannable should BSL hit home. I love her dearly - but I would put her down if I ever thought she were people-aggressive, just to avoid another headline.
Anyway - Frannie, my dogs are house dogs. All shots and quite spoiled to boot. If anything starts acting funny about my boo-boo I'll get it checked out. Actually my neighbor is a nurse, so I'll bring some Amish Friendship bread over, and ask her first. |
| CabinCreek-Kentucky |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 06:41:42 AM
lynn .. if you have had rabies shots for your dogs .. that a 'good thang' .. if they are outdoor dogs .. that's a strike against you.
if the wounds are DEEP .. you reeeeeeely might want to have a doc look at it. we had a little dog that looked like a fuzzy bedroom slipper .. but had the teeth of a pirhana. he was a snuggly love .. UNLESS .. he didn't know you and you came a-calling! amazing Guard Dog! he, did, indeed bite two people over the course of his life. (i was told THREE and he is automatically 'put down'). (this was YEARS ago .. and he is now in doggie-heaven .. lived to a ripe olde 17 years of age .. with all his 'teeth' still intact!) Well, anyhoo, we just had to 'quarantine' him for about 10 days (at our home) .. we had proof he had all his shots. I would be concerned about serious infections from deep puncture wounds. Best to go get it checked, i think. keep us informed! xo, frannie
True Friends, Frannie |
| BlueEggBabe |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 06:24:40 AM
"scruitny with BSL (along with rotties and pitties)".
Lynn,
What is BSL?? I assume they would be asking the rabies questions as well.
I once went through a terrible ordeal with a 12 week old kitten that had an abcess. Long story short, it scratched me, like kitty's do... Anyway, the vet scared me into putting it down for a BIG,OVERGROWN fear of rabies. It was recorded, I had to answer a million questions, I was scolded for not getting it immediate vaccinations,
blah blah blah.....
I paid alot of money to have it put down and tested.
Of course, the test result was negative and I lost a sweet cat.
Please take care and rest today.
Maybe take some extra Vitamin C and warm compresses?
Sue
www.feedsackfarmgirls.blogspot.com
www.farmatcoventry.com
"If more of us valued good food, cheer and song above hoarded gold,the world would be a merrier place."
J.J.R.Tolkien |
| greyghost |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 05:44:03 AM
Thanks BlueEgg!
Well, I'm hoping to avoid having it looked at. Anytime someone goes in for a dog bite, the bite has to be recorded with some national statistic thing and I just don't want one of my girls recorded there. It's too easy to jump from "Shepherd Mix" to German Shepherd, and those dogs are under some scruitny with BSL (along with rotties and pitties).
May seem paranoid - but I know of all too many mistakes in reporting bite cases. I spend a portion of my day looking up stats and current dog bite stories because they are so often misreported (and writing letters to the editor)! |
| BlueEggBabe |
Posted - Dec 13 2005 : 05:38:26 AM
oHHH! Lynn, 
How painful...do you think you need to have it looked at?
Please keep an eye on that wound. It sounds like it must have been deep. Not sure what else I would recommend...but I just had to reply.
Take Care!! and keep us posted.
Will keep your healing in my prayers today.
Sue
www.feedsackfarmgirls.blogspot.com
www.farmatcoventry.com
"If more of us valued good food, cheer and song above hoarded gold,the world would be a merrier place."
J.J.R.Tolkien |
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