| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 06:24:33 AM
My largest rescued dog, Owie, has had two horrible seizures in the past month. The vet has put him on phenobarbitol twice a day. There is a possibility this may damage his liver, so he has to be tested again in a few weeks. I've been reading up on this, and I am now giving him Milk Thistle(I twist the capsules open and sprinkle the powder in his food) to boost his liver function. Does anyone have any other suggestions/advice? And for some reason, he is no longer sleeping through the night. Help! Any suggestions about helping him sleep would be greatly appreciated! I'm sleeping very little, as well.(both of his seizures were in the middle of the night without warning, so I just keep listening).
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| 16 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 15 2007 : 1:37:24 PM
Kathy - I bought "Natural Healing for Dogs & Cats"(D. Stein)and "The Holistic Puppy"(D. Stein) both from the same dealer on half.com - my total was just a little over $8.00 - hooray! Then I found "The Natural Remedy Book" on ebay with a $1.00 starting bid, so I left my bid(the same dealer also had another D. Stein book on natural remedies for women, so I bid on that one, too). Can you recommend a good general book on the Bach flower remedies(sort of a "Bach Remedies for Dummies")?
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 15 2007 : 1:00:06 PM
Kathy - Thanks a million for the name of that book. I'm going to go on half.com and try to find a copy for myself. I've been using Rescue Remedy and I really love it! And one of the professors at the school were I work does Greyhound Rescue and has the name of a holistic vet she really likes, so in a few weeks, after I take Owie back to the regular vet and I see how his liver test comes back, I'm probably going to consult with the holistic woman. I've been wondering about the possibility of a lower dose, since he hasn't had a hint of a seizure since he's been on phenobarb. So I'm very interested in the fact that you've been able to lower your dog's dose. I've gotten so much more information and comfort/support from this forum than dealing with this vet at the emergency clinic. He's a good enough guy, but we don't seem to be on the same 'wavelength'. I think I'm not supposed to question anything, just 'go along' with what he says.
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| EnchantedWoodsGirl |
Posted - Mar 15 2007 : 12:40:40 PM
The very first cocker I bought at a pet store (Hun Bunch) has had a few seizures, the last one many years ago was a grand mal seizure. My husband thought she was choking but it was a seizure and I held her to protect her during it - she lost urine and was very tired afterwards. She started out on phenobarb liquid twice a day for a long time but I have weaned her to 2cc every other day and she has been fine since then. It was the last dog I ever bought from a pet store - the poor dear also ended up with juvenile cataracts. She is much older now and nearly blind but she is a great dog that just came from a bad background.
Good luck with your dog - I would first consult with a vet that deals with holistic/natural health care before giving any herbal treatment - I have a book called The Natural Remedy Book for Dogs and Cats by Diane Stein and it recommends Skullcap tincture, it also makes mention of these herbs - black cohosh, hyssop, lobelia, wood sage, rue, hops, rosemary, blue vervain and oatstraw - also recommded is Rescue Remedy made from flower essences.
Kathy of the Enchanted Wood
http://enchantedwoodmusings.blogspot.com/
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| Kim |
Posted - Mar 14 2007 : 08:00:28 AM
I try not to use those either. Especially after I read that the oil are fresheners are back for you. Little particles of oil can stay in the air and be breathed in by us. I read about it several years ago somewhere.
Blessed Be!
farmgirl@heart
Be at peace with yourself and the rest will follow
http://chevy49girl.livejournal.com/
http://midwestmusings-kim.blogspot.com/
http://chevy49girl.deviantart.com/ |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 14 2007 : 07:23:04 AM
I'm so sorry about Hobo, Robin. I like to think there's a special level in Hell for people who run puppy mills. But I'm glad Hobo, Owie and Kim's Chloe found the three of us. When I said I'm going around looking for environmental dangers in my house, there is one thing in particular I noticed. I had recently installed one of those Glade plug in air fresheners. A couple of times, I noticed him sniffing the air and looking in the direction where one was downstairs. Then, later, he would stand in the hallway and look/sniff upstairs, where I had one at the top of the stairs. I unplugged them and the next night, I woke up to that smell. He was awake, too, and sniffing the air. I had laid one on a window ledge, and it still smelled very strong. I picked it up to throw it in the garbage, and the smell stayed on my hand. I washed my hand over and over and STILL that awful odor! Like a chemical curse! Finally, I reached for Tasha's new hand scrub and scrubbed and scrubbed. Success at last! Tasha saved the day! And now I'm super sensitive about all household cleaning products. Everything I spray, I watch his reaction. I'm now printing household 'green' cleaning recipes from this website and I'm THROUGH with the chemical soup!
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| ThymeForEweFarm |
Posted - Mar 14 2007 : 06:04:59 AM
quote:
Did your dog continue to have siezures, in spite of being on medication?
He did. It ultimately lead to having him put to sleep. He had a lot of problems when he came here through a rescue organization in Puerto Rico. He was a puppy mill dog who went to a pet store. He lived in a cage the first six months of his life. He spent a month with a woman in a city apartment in San Juan. She couldn't do anything with him. When she took him in for shots the vet told her he was 100% bilaterally deaf. He had personality disorders that were bizarre.
Hobo's personality sometimes changed when he had a seizure. In the last month of his life he became too rough with my other dogs, then got bossy (typical BC behavior), then went from bossy to snapping at the dogs. He deliberately got up, crossed the great room and snapped at one dog while that dog was sitting on a kid's lap. That was the end. We had him put to sleep. I called my husband while he was on his way to the vet's office to ask him if he was SURE this was the right thing to do. Hobo was growling and snarling at every dog he saw. It was the right thing. It's probably safe to say 99% of dogs don't have this kind of personality change. The deck was stacked against Hobo before he was even born.
quote:
Poor Owie was very disoriented, especially after the last, most violent one. Do you have any ideas/thoughts on anything that may have triggered the seizures?
It could be genetic. Or it could be an injury. Has he banged his head? It could be environmental. Has he gotten into something he shouldn't have eaten? Been exposed to a new chemical on the lawn or garden? Have the neighbors sprayed anything lately?
quote:
He had maggots in his wounds, which the vet said actually kept the wound sort of clean.
Rather gross but useful. Maggots debride wounds of dead tissue. No wonder he's named Owie!
Robin
SALE! http://www.localharvest.org/store/M572?srt=2
www.outdoorwriter.wordpress.com
www.thymeforewe.com
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| Kim |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 1:21:43 PM
How cute!
Chloe was a rescue, too. She was nursed back to health by the vet, after being left outside all year round and having heat stroke.
She's a 60 lb *lap* dog (grunt).
Blessed Be!
farmgirl@heart
Be at peace with yourself and the rest will follow
http://chevy49girl.livejournal.com/
http://midwestmusings-kim.blogspot.com/
http://chevy49girl.deviantart.com/ |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 12:37:33 PM
You guessed it, Kim! :) In fact, he had holes all across his backbone, like he had gotten caught in a barbed wire fence, or some animal had caught him. He was a very wee small puppy when he was 'thrown out' on a friend's farm. He had maggots in his wounds, which the vet said actually kept the wound sort of clean. But when the vet cleaned his wounds and put medication on him, he made this tiny little squeaky sound that sounded like 'OWIE, OWIE'. And now, five years later, he weighs in at 72 pounds! That's pretty large for a lap dog/momma's boy. :D
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| Kim |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 12:27:28 PM
I'm condfident Owie will be fine! How did he get the name Owie? Makes me think he had a *big owie* on his paw or something! 
Blessed Be!
farmgirl@heart
Be at peace with yourself and the rest will follow
http://chevy49girl.livejournal.com/
http://midwestmusings-kim.blogspot.com/
http://chevy49girl.deviantart.com/ |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 11:12:40 AM
Kim, considering what I've read about the strange and random things that may cause these seizures, I think what you say is more than a coincidence. It seems that stress may even contribute. And before both seizures, my poor dog hadn't been let out the last thing at night. He will NOT let himself mess up in the house. He has thrown up before because he was upset about needing to go out. I think the stress was too much for him. He's very high strung and sensitive. And after reading a list of possible environmental triggers for dog seizures which included fluorescent light bulbs(I was just starting to go 'green' with compact fluorescents, too...oh well...) and plug in air fresheners, I'm going over the house and getting rid of anything offensive. Thanks to you all. I feel much relieved after hearing your experiences.
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| Kim |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 10:22:51 AM
We thought that Chloe hitting her head on the coffee table may have caused the sudden onslaught of seizures. Vet said no, but the weird thing is it started the day after she fell off the couch.
Hers only lasted 30 seconds each, but it seemed forever. Throwing up is common. The golden I used to have, had mini seizures, her chin would quiver or her ears would twitch. She would always throw up afterwards.
We talked to Chloe and petted her through it all. The vet said it was ok and she never snapped at us. She did forget to let us know when she had to go potty. She would have accidents in the house, but for the most part they have stopped. But she went in the house often enough that we had to buy a Little Green Machine!
Now we just put her in her crate before we go to work. She doesn't mind. She lets us know when she needs to go out, much more vocally now and we take her. Even if it is 2 am. It's hard to deal with when you can't explain to them what is going on.
Chloe was very sluggish for a month or so. So much so that when she napped on my lap, I was able to trim her toenails with out her waking up and biting me!! She also went through a period when she didn't like having her face washed, which she LOVED having done. But now she's back to loving it. So, be patient.
Blessed Be!
farmgirl@heart
Be at peace with yourself and the rest will follow
http://chevy49girl.livejournal.com/
http://midwestmusings-kim.blogspot.com/
http://chevy49girl.deviantart.com/ |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 10:05:25 AM
Robin - He sleeps sometimes on the bed and sometimes he will go and crawl in a crate and sleep. I can hear him all the time. In the two seizures he had, he was standing up at the time, then he started to heave, then he threw up and fell on his back on the ground and started to 'seize'. We thought he was dying, so my husband tried to 'bring him to'. I understand now that doing nothing is the right thing to do. Did your dog continue to have siezures, in spite of being on medication? Poor Owie was very disoriented, especially after the last, most violent one. Do you have any ideas/thoughts on anything that may have triggered the seizures?
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| Miss Bee Haven |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 09:56:05 AM
Thanks to you both, Kim and Luzy. Kim - I can't imagine 10 seizures in a day's time. How awful for you and your dog. But you've given me hope that maybe in a few more weeks, he may go back to his normal sleep pattern. He is thirstier(the vet said that's caused by the phenobarb). I monitor his water intake at night and let him out the last thing before 'lights out'. I only started the milk thistle last week, so I don't think that's causing his wakefulness. And I'm more hopeful that he can live a lot more years with a good quality of life. I need to be more accepting and at peace with this. Right now, I'm treating my poor dog like he has a bomb strapped to him and he could explode at any time - I'm watching him too closely.
"If you think you've got it nailed down, then what's all that around it?" - 'Brother Dave' Gardner |
| ThymeForEweFarm |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 09:40:30 AM
I have a border collie who had seizures. He was young when it started so he went on potassium bromide instead of phenobarb.
Once the meds build up in his sytem he might go back to sleeping soundly at night. Hobo had almost all of his seizures during the night. Your dog might be having small seizures. Is he where you can see him at night? Hobo was crated at night so hearing him was easy. As soon as he started paddling on the crate we knew what was happening.
In case the vet hasn't told you:
Let him be while he seizes. If you try to soothe him while he's coming out of it he might mistakenly think you've done something to him. He isn't going to remember what happened but he'll know something was "off." I learned this lesson when Hobo snapped at me. It's a wonder he didn't make contact.
Don't hold him down. Just watch. If it continues more than three minutes call the vet's office.
Watch for personality changes.
Hyperactivity or sluggishness are normal after a seizure. Hobo was hyperactive except after a few very big seizures that wiped him out for hours. He knew he was doing things he shouldn't have been doing but he didn't seem to be able to stop himself. The only thing that calmed him down was allowing him to curl up in my husband's recliner. It wasn't allowed at any other time but for some unknown reason, he was determined to do this after a seizure. At 2 a.m. who cares what it takes as long as we could could both get back to sleep!
Loss of bowls and bladder are nothing to be concerned about. It's normal.
Good luck with him!
Robin
SALE! http://www.localharvest.org/store/M572?srt=2
www.outdoorwriter.wordpress.com
www.thymeforewe.com
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| Luzy |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 08:07:57 AM
I had a little mixed breed(weiner/???) and I had to give him pheno too. He lived to be 12 yrs old and had no other problems. This was many years ago and we only gave it to him AFTER he had a seizure. Looking back now, that seems strange doesn't it? I wish you all the best with your four footed baby. I know how hard it it to see them go through this. Hang in there, hugs, Lu
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May I always be the kind of person my dog thinks I am. |
| Kim |
Posted - Mar 13 2007 : 06:57:08 AM
My English Bulldog, had epileptic seizures. She had 10 in a 24 hour time frame. Before they put her on pheno, the vet did a complete blood workup to rule out low blood sugar, thyroid problems, diabetes and other things. She sleeps through the night, but it took her about a month before she was back to normal.
It takes awhile to get their body used to it. For awhile, she slept ALL the time. I have noticed she drinks a lot more water now.
Type in the type of dog you have and seizures on the internet. I found a wealth of information in a chat room on bulldogs and seizures. There m ay be someone out there that had a similar issue with their dog. It's not the milk thistle is it?
Blessed Be!
farmgirl@heart
Be at peace with yourself and the rest will follow
http://chevy49girl.livejournal.com/
http://midwestmusings-kim.blogspot.com/
http://chevy49girl.deviantart.com/ |
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