| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| mikesgirl |
Posted - Feb 17 2009 : 09:50:57 AM
Did anyone watch this documentary that was on a couple of nights ago about the children of Appalachia? What did you think?
Farmgirl Sister #98
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| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Thistle Cove Farm |
Posted - Mar 01 2009 : 2:20:38 PM
Linda in PA - good for YOU! Just because er has problems or difficulties doesn't mean we can't be productive within our limitations, of course. Some days are better than others.
It's a mind set; some have a work ethic and others have their hands out. I find those with a work ethic are far ore interesting people -smile-. I'll stop and listen to them and learn while I tend to travel, very quickly, by those with their hands out. Not all the time though; if I feel God asking me to give someone money, I'll do it and not question where it's spent. After it leaves me, it's a gift and between them and their God.
Good topic, enjoyed and learned a lot...thanks, people!
Re the Stitching Book - looking very forward to reading and using it, thanks for the recommendation.
Thistle Cove Farm ~ God's blessings on you, yours and the work of your hands & heart ~
www.thistlecovefarm.com
www.thistlecovefarm.blogspot.com |
| yarnmamma |
Posted - Feb 26 2009 : 05:34:41 AM
I think you will enjoy the Stitching book...it's the only MJ book I have and I really love it!
Linda
in Scranton, PA
farmgirl #71 |
| yarnmamma |
Posted - Feb 26 2009 : 05:33:38 AM
I have been reading this topic and appreciate and enjoy it.
I have been on disability for many years and most of the time I find volunteer work to do. I believe in giving back to our community who takes care of me. The many many older or sick people who do this should be acknowledged for it. I have to be careful because my health problems can hinder doing the jobs but I believe anyone can find a place to "work" and volunteer work is valuable. I always like to say that we get things more valuable than money.
Keep the conversation going...I'm enjoying this.
Linda
in Scranton, PA
farmgirl #71 |
| Contrary Wife |
Posted - Feb 26 2009 : 05:01:35 AM
There is a saying I like that really would solve it all if people would just do it, it goes like this~ "Don't ask anyone to do something for you that you can do for yourself". It pretty much sums it up, those that could should and then a person wouldn't mind helping the ones that really can't.
Teresa Sue
Farmgirl Sister #316
Planting Zone 3
"Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly." The Dalai Lama |
| Thistle Cove Farm |
Posted - Feb 26 2009 : 04:40:40 AM
It's a fine line, straddling between helping, helping, helping and being angry when people just sit on their tush and wait for the help. I'm not talking the seriously disabled, the infirm, the people too old but we had chores when we were just little tykes. We helped sit and clear the table, take out trash, feed the pets...all of those things that build useful, productive, tax paying citizens. I've been in homes...make that houses...where a child was asked to help sit the table and threw a tantrum. Where the adults...the adults!...yelled at each other and whoever could yell the loudest was the one who felt they had more to say.
The fabric of society is being torn, ripped, shredded. I truly believe if people would Slow Down, that would be a good start toward leading better lives.
Or, is that a pig flying across the mountain? -smile-
Thistle Cove Farm ~ God's blessings on you, yours and the work of your hands & heart ~
www.thistlecovefarm.com
www.thistlecovefarm.blogspot.com |
| Old Spirit |
Posted - Feb 26 2009 : 03:02:28 AM
Soapboxes are a very nice place at times ;-) I work in public schools and teach kids social skills cause too many parents don't!!!
You know we learned all the book stuff but also learned skills such as cooking and sewing.
Ooops my soapbox :-)
Rae
...those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles:...
Isaiah 40:31 |
| Thistle Cove Farm |
Posted - Feb 25 2009 : 8:13:01 PM
If miners made $160,000.00 a year it still wouldn't be enough to get me in a mine. Dave had to go into a mine last year. He went 3 miles into the earth, flat on his back and if he'd raised his head, it would have been taken off for his troubles. Some of the mines are only 36 inches deep and that means the miners lay on their backs all day, every work day. I've yet to meet an old miner who didn't have black lung.
I've always said...if you've eaten today...thank a farmer. If you've used an vehicle for transportation, fliped on a light switch or are using a computer...thank a coal miner.
When home ec stopped being a priority in high school, people stopped learning how to put a simple, nourishing meal on the table. I hate going to the grocery and seeing all the carts filled with sodas, chips, and the like. It's rare I see food, I mean real food...beans, rice, potatoes, carrots, cheese...stuff to make a meal that's nourishing and will stick to your bones.
I feel like the old professor in Narnia...WHAT are they teaching in school nowadays? Around here it's SOL's - standards of learning - the kids can tell you when the Spanish Armada took place but they have no idea what it was, what it meant, who was involved. I had one girl ask, "ummm, was Spain involved?" Gee. Ya think?
The folks on these forums encourage me; I read where people are canning, dehydrating, growing their own food, sewing, knitting, quilting...the list goes on and on and it just gives me hope. I just ordered the MJF Stitchery book and am reading the Outpost book. Why? To learn and to encourage me and to give me hope.
Gosh, won't someone yank me off this soapbox?! I seem to be stuck!
Thistle Cove Farm ~ God's blessings on you, yours and the work of your hands & heart ~
www.thistlecovefarm.com
www.thistlecovefarm.blogspot.com |
| LynnDinKY |
Posted - Feb 25 2009 : 7:44:15 PM
This is a topic that I really struggle with. Even in the Metro areas of KY, there are people that have food stamps, WIC, Section 8 housing and other benefits. I have worked at grocery stores in a small town and I would see these people come in and buy BAGS upon BAGS of candy with food stamps. I was in total shock. They would buy soda, little Debbie treats... all sorts of junk food with Food stamps. I realllllllly struggled with not saying anything. I don't mind people needing food stamps, or other programs. It's the buying the junk food that I have a problem with. I truly don't understand why the government doesn't say, "okay, enough, from now on only healthy food"
It would save soooooooo much money on so many different levels.
Okay, I get off my soapbox.
Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting; but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised. Proverbs 31:30 |
| Old Spirit |
Posted - Feb 25 2009 : 3:20:15 PM
I can understand not working in the mines. They should pay good with the conditions people are exposed to.
The thing that upsets me is when people stand with hands out but yet waste money on luxury type of items in comparison to food, clothing, etc.. Everyone needs help of one kind sometime in life but to expect it is a whole other story.
...those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles:...
Isaiah 40:31 |
| Contrary Wife |
Posted - Feb 25 2009 : 2:35:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by SarahAnn
I felt that some considered the large wages for mining should have made those in the region lining up for jobs.
[/quote]
On the program it was said that the football player was looking for ,but could not find a job and his father told that there was no work in the area.So for this reason I do consider that If the mine is hiring and paying the great starting wages of 60,000 a year then they should take advantage of the mining jobs.
My grandfather worked the mines in that area as well as two of his sons and they all loved the job.They worked the mines until retirement.
I think it is interesting that the young man who was working in the mine also told that he "loved it".I have met many miners who say they love working the mines, however some people who have never stepped foot into a mine say it is a bad job. I do agree that it may cause wives and family to worry ,but many of the miners love the work.
[/quote]
What I was trying to say with my comment is just because the mines paid high wages doesn't mean everyone wants or is suited for that type of job. My father was a deep mine miner also so I am aware of different aspects of this subject.
Teresa Sue
Farmgirl Sister #316
Planting Zone 3
"Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly." The Dalai Lama |
| Old Spirit |
Posted - Feb 25 2009 : 2:22:06 PM
Or how about complaining they have no food so everyone helps out yet they have cell phones, yes more than one and laptops and etc... All about priorities and helping yourself somewhat at least.
Rae
...those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles:...
Isaiah 40:31 |
| Thistle Cove Farm |
Posted - Feb 25 2009 : 07:07:52 AM
New...again and new to this topic. Mom told me about the Sawyer's documentary but I've yet to see it. Let's face it, Appalachia has always been the tired old cow the media drags out when they need a new, or larger, viewer ship. Do you think the media would DARE to do such a documentary on urban ghettos? Or, are they even called ghettos any more? NO because people would scream racist, yet it's okay to do such a story on Appalachia.
In the 1960's when Johnson started his War on Poverty on Tommy Fletcher's front yard in eastern KY, Appalachia got a lot of funding, most notably from the Appalachian Regional Commission. In recent years, funding has gone from hard supplies funding -food, shelter, clothing- to helping people earn more income by developing, marketing, promoting venues for crafters and artists. But, one has to want to help themselves by going to the workshops, getting on the lists, etc. KY, NC and now VA has such non-profit organizations, in VA it's www.roundthemountain.org; in NC it's www.handmadeinamerica.org -or maybe .com, can't remember- and can't remember what it is in KY but know they have one.
I just wrote about this on my blog January 27, 2009 entry when I wrote about the 5 Loaves and 2 Fishes Foodbank losing their food and funding. McDowell County, WV was one of the four or five counties Johnson used when he initiated the War on Poverty campaign. The food bank operated solely on donations and run entirely by volunteers...not a single person was paid, not even the direction who has had several heart surgeries and was told a few months ago by the hospital staff, 'go home, we've done all we can do. You're living on borrowed time."
My family has been in Appalachia for about 250 years so, perhaps, I see the problem differently. I think, a lot of the time, we're our own worst enemy. Some of us have the "we're from Appalachia and we're as good as anybody" mentality. I've heard that come from a young man's mouth as he was going off to university. It surprised me he would even think such a thing. I mean, why would he think we we NOT as good as any one living in other parts of the country? He's going to be his own worst enemy in life unless he changes his attitude.
I live in southwest VA, in Appalachia, and wouldn't live anywhere else in the world. I've been to some lovely places, lived in other lovely places but these old mountains are home. I've found in life there are those who want to live differently from me and who am I to judge. I help when I'm allowed to help, give quietly when there's a need but to people and/or organizations that are run by volunteers not to places that have high overhead and highly paid staff.
One thing I've learned in life, a lot of people find it far easier to hold their hands out than to make changes in their lives. We've bred a 'hand-out' mentality in this country and until we start focusing on getting people to learn how to do something, establishing a work ethic instead of expecting free money, food, clothes, shelter...we'll always have the same old problems.
On another tangent...why can't people on government disability checks be expected to do community service work? I see a lot of "disabled" people, getting their government checks one day and the next day riding their tractors down the road to bale hay or putting up fences or other farm work.
Gosh, can you tell that really burns me up? -smile-
Thistle Cove Farm ~ God's blessings on you, yours and the work of your hands & heart ~
www.thistlecovefarm.com
www.thistlecovefarm.blogspot.com |
| mikesgirl |
Posted - Feb 23 2009 : 08:22:35 AM
Did anyone see the update on the show on 20/20 a couple of nights ago? Diane updated on all the help everyone had received since the original airing.
Farmgirl Sister #98
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| Old Spirit |
Posted - Feb 23 2009 : 03:11:20 AM
Kate,
I do have to agree with you about some the stand with hands out expecting government and others to just bail them out, the owe me attitude. There is a lot of poverty and it is in every state, I see it as well and I see some of the priorities mixed up just as in the show. There are those that try and never get a break and those are the ones that should get the extra help.
Another MN
Rae
...those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles:...
Isaiah 40:31 |
| kissmekate |
Posted - Feb 22 2009 : 5:11:54 PM
I watched this program and all I could think was that perhaps people don't want to help themselves?
I thought it was interesting that "they" didn't have money to buy milk, fresh fruits and veggies, but they had plenty of money for soda, Doritos and cigarettes.
Speaking as a mother of two, who has struggled as a single parent for years, I found it sad that the Moms on this show didn't think to provide basic dental/hygiene care. i.e.-a tube of tooth paste and a toothbrush at the very least.
I know our tiny little bitty city food shelf has these items on hand. I would presume to think other food shelves would too.
Sadly, though, I think this show could have taken place in any state in our country, it isn't an issue in just in one state/region.
I also think some people would rather wallow in self pity, and/or demand hand outs, than make their life better. Sadly, the little children get stuck in the middle in the meantime and another cycle begins.
And I hope I didn't offend anyone. These are just my opinions. I do realize there are those who do bust their tails to get out of the situations they're in. But, in the same breath, there are a lot who can't get out of their own way, and won't help them self. They are waiting for someone (the government) to do it for them.
I think if some of us make an effort to pay attention to our own backyard, we can help these types of situations and break the cycle.
Don't miss out on a blessing, just because it isn't packaged the way you expected. ~MaryJo Copeland |
| SarahAnn |
Posted - Feb 19 2009 : 1:24:50 PM
[/quote]I felt that some considered the large wages for mining should have made those in the region lining up for jobs.
[/quote]
On the program it was said that the football player was looking for ,but could not find a job and his father told that there was no work in the area.So for this reason I do consider that If the mine is hiring and paying the great starting wages of 60,000 a year then they should take advantage of the mining jobs.
My grandfather worked the mines in that area as well as two of his sons and they all loved the job.They worked the mines until retirement.
I think it is interesting that the young man who was working in the mine also told that he "loved it".I have met many miners who say they love working the mines, however some people who have never stepped foot into a mine say it is a bad job. I do agree that it may cause wives and family to worry ,but many of the miners love the work.
|
| shepherdgirl |
Posted - Feb 19 2009 : 12:04:10 PM
The workings of the human mind and the human heart are quite a puzzle are they not? You ladies have ALL made good points on this topic.
I think it all boils down to this-- Children LEARN what they are TAUGHT. But, again, you can take two kids (or more) from the same exact circumstances and they can turn out to be completely different people. It all comes down to choices. The choices THEY make as they grow into adulthood and even when they become adults. They can either learn to be BETTER than their parents, or they can choose to just like them-- or even worse.
But, like Cathy said, a GREAT mentor in a young life can make a WORLD of difference. Think of all those people who HAVE come from "Humble" beginings and made such a big impact on this world. And all because ONE person took the time to SHOW them that they cared....
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away. ~~ George Carlin |
| FebruaryViolet |
Posted - Feb 19 2009 : 05:58:41 AM
I understand, Teresa Sue...it's often difficult to articulate things that affect us on a deep level.
Cathy...Grants Lick is about 20 minutes down the road from my office in Covington, just out US 27. It's building up now, though--I'm wondering if your dad would even recognize it, sadly. Kentucky IS a beautiful place, though--I heartily agree. That's why, after living in NYC, England, Michigan and Boston, I came back home to this gorgeous Ohio Valley. |
| homergirl1957 |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 5:05:05 PM
forget to say how absolutely beautiful kentucky is!!! we went back to grants lick several years ago and the folks i met lived simply and were some of the friendliest,most gracious people i have ever met. we were actually stationed at fort knox in the mid 60's ( lived in radcliffe). i hope all of you get the chance to visit ky. at some point. beautiful little farms, rolling hills, meandering creeks, absolutely beautiful!
cathy
in the midst of difficulty lies opportunity.-a. einstein |
| Contrary Wife |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 5:03:13 PM
quote:
Originally posted by FebruaryViolet
"The comments about the miners making so much money and that they should be thankful for it..."
You didn't offend me, but I never said anyone should be thankful for it. I said that it's a considerable sum, especially for the economic median in the region, but one must weigh the pros and cons.
There is something to be said about moderation and common sense, not much of which I saw presented in this documentary. Most of which is a media portrayal. I'm in agreement with Jessica that they could have put a more positive spin on the people that have come from the region and made good.
Your point is noted. I didn't mean to turn your words. Like I said, this bothered me on many, many levels and frankly I struggled to articulate my thoughts on the subject. But I felt that some considered the large wages for mining should have made those in the region lining up for jobs.
Teresa Sue
Farmgirl Sister #316
Planting Zone 3
"Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly." The Dalai Lama |
| homergirl1957 |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 4:45:40 PM
hey everybody,
my father grew up in grants lick, kentucky. when he was 8 years old his mother gave him and his two sisters up to an orphanage in hamilton, ohio. it was during the great depression and she couldn't raise them. my dad ran away at the tender age of 16 yrs and joined the army. long story short, he met one officer while in the army who saw his potential and mentored him. dad went on to be a lt. colonel in the army, served in korea and vietnam, raised 4 kids, retired from the army, went back to college and obtained his teaching degree and later become the range officer at the yakima firing center, the largest facility of its kind to train men and women from armed forces here and abroad. soooo, my point is lets focus on trying to find just one person, be it a kid or adult to show the way so to speak, many successful people will tell you that one person in thier lives made all the differnce just by telling them they were worth a salt and that they mattered. a kind word or gesture works wonders more than any amount of money or handout. just simply letting that lost kid know that he or she matters. so, maybe we could focus on helping just one person at a time.
cathy
in the midst of difficulty lies opportunity.-a. einstein |
| kydeere40744 |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 3:15:50 PM
Good news...this Friday they are doing a followup of the show from last week. Apparently a lot of folks took interest..."The show was the highest rated prime-time program Friday, drawing 10.9 million viewers, according to Nielsen Media Research. It was the biggest 20/20 audience since 2004."
Here is more details from the Lexington Herald Leader:
http://www.kentucky.com/181/story/699179.html
I forgot to mention that as far as the pop in the schools, that is not everywhere. Most of the time it is bottled water in the high schools. This just started about 10 or so years ago. I know in my high school they allowed it our senior year because it allowed the kids to be hydrated instead of getting a small milk at lunch and that's it.
Our education program is different than most states and even inside individual counties the teaching is totally different. My high school was a model for the 4 classes per day & certain days one would be longer, etc. Something I did want to point out that there have been many bright young individuals that have come "from the hill" so to speak who have done very well in this society. I think it took a program like this to show "hey this is in our own backyard" whether you were from Kentucky or even way out in California.
The drug problem became rampent somewhat because there were drug companies pushing for their medicines especially in the heart of the region. I know this because one of my best friends use to be a rep. She got out of it because she didn't have the heart to sit there and sell the drug knowing the doctor is going to prescribe it heavily to patients. Doctors would write prescriptions for narcotics if you had a headache or toothache or whatever. Now days, you are lucky to find anyone to prescribe anything stronger than ibuprofen or a very weak narcotic, even after surgery & you have a clean record with no drug problems! There is some good in that drug task forces were formed and they helped get rid of a lot of the drug rings, but not all.
As far as coal mining, sometimes it is what you have to do because your dad, grandad, etc did it. My husband's grandpa was a miner back growing up. There were no other job opportunities. Factories have come and gone in the region (Carhart being one of them) or they won't even come.
Progress takes time. Some folks live how they were raised and probably don't know any better or were never taught how to do certain things. So in the end, being able to help fund programs that will help these people is a good thing. It will be interesting to see what the followups are this Friday and hopefully they will be positive ones.
Sorry about my long posts on this topic...it's one that touches the heart. I was born and raised there, I've studied it in college, and it's one that I always love to call "home".
Jessica in KY |
| FebruaryViolet |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 11:31:05 AM
"The comments about the miners making so much money and that they should be thankful for it..."
You didn't offend me, but I never said anyone should be thankful for it. I said that it's a considerable sum, especially for the economic median in the region, but one must weigh the pros and cons.
There is something to be said about moderation and common sense, not much of which I saw presented in this documentary. Most of which is a media portrayal. I'm in agreement with Jessica that they could have put a more positive spin on the people that have come from the region and made good.
|
| melody |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 10:35:16 AM
AMEN! Teresa Sue. |
| Contrary Wife |
Posted - Feb 18 2009 : 07:36:23 AM
A few things bother me about this thread. First, I agree that everyone needs to earn their keep. Drugs are just stupid, and even as someone who grew up during the drug revolution(late 60'/early 70's)I never could see why anyone would be interested in that lifestyle. Still a mystery to me. The comments about the miners making so much money and that they should be thankful for it bothers me because I don't think you realize what miners actually have to do to earn that money. There has been a long history of mining companies and their actions, or should I say, inactions, as far as the conditions miners work in. If you have never been down, deep, deep, down in the earth via a mine, trust me, it's not like working in an office without a window, but much worse. I have always felt that if you have to, you move to where the work is. That is what I have done many times. Some of the other things that bother me are the comments about no running water or indoor plumbing. These things are conviences, they are not a must have in order to be a perfect citizen or person. Yes, I live in a house with running water and I have electricity, but I have lived otherwise, and personally if I had to choose between having one or the other, I would take running water. Or at least water, that I didn't have to haul very far. From the reading I have done, it seems that a well maintained composting outhouse is much more ecologically sound solution that flushing all our waste into our streams, rivers, and oceans. Out of sight, out of mind is not nearly the neat and tidy solution that most Americans think it is. Our country has many problems, people have entitlement issues, kids and adults, don't do chores because of the conviences offered in fast foods and labor saving devices. Adults don't teach their children values or moral. The government wants to control so much of our lives and our citizens are more than happy to let them do it. We haven't any common sense anymore. Like banning pop from school is a great idea, but banning bake sales? It's like throwing the baby out with the bath water, to coin an old phrase. Moderation is the key, eating sweets 24/7 is bad for you. Having a cookie with a cup of tea, especially if it is homemade with good, organic foods is not the end of the world. Neglecting children is a very bad thing and that should not be happening, but that happens even in families that are considered "mainstream". Education is really the only thing that will help. But, the kicker is this, whose ideas are they going to be educated with? Like one of the above posts mentioned, there is nothing wrong with living in a small house, w/o elec or running water,gardening, canning, etc and living a simple life if you do it with intent and integrity. Just because your life isn't centered around consumerism, doesn't mean it's a bad life. As pointed out above, not everyone in that area is like the people in the news story. Think about people you know, "good" families and "bad". Everyone knows of kids from "good" familes going the wrong way, and of course, the "good" kid from the "bad" family being succesful All, in, all the only thing any of us can do, is live each of our lives in a way that is an example of what we would like the world to be. It's all perspective. And you have to keep in mind, TV does what it has to for ratings or to twist whatever agenda they are interested in. Oh, one last thought, if I remember my history, the majority of the country thought the American Indians needed to live in "better" conditions too, now they are dealing with the same problems the rest of us are. Like I said before, this subject bothers me on many levels. If I offended anyone, I apologize, as that was not my intent.
Teresa Sue
Farmgirl Sister #316
Planting Zone 3
"Learn the rules so you know how to break them properly." The Dalai Lama |
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